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View Full Version : Pork box - judge and critique please


Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 11:03 AM
This is a turn in for pork, i believe it took 13th out of around 45 teams

HeSmellsLikeSmoke
12-17-2008, 11:17 AM
Other than looking a little dry in the picture -- which it might not have looked like in real life -- that box looks very good to me. If it looked moist at the time, I would have given it an 8, if not a 7.

Perhaps that stringy piece on the right pops out and distracts somewhat, but I wouldn't have counted down for that.

butts a fire
12-17-2008, 11:35 AM
I would give it a 7 or 8. I like the chunks but to get the 9 I think you should have more bark showing and maybe a little shine to make it pop and the pulled is a little distracting and does not add to the overall appearance to me. I don't really grade on garnish unless it is really distracting so it did not affect the score at all.

KC_Bobby
12-17-2008, 12:15 PM
6 - I think that's an average looking pork box

Someone's going to call the score harsh, so here's my reasoning - It looks like a pile of huge pork chunks with some strands of pork to the front. The barked pieces are hidden, had they been on top the score may have been higher. Simply, its appearance doesn't make me feel like I need to have a sample now.

All that said, if I were a judge it probably would have got a 7 because a 6 is generally as low as I go unless it's God-awful and it's not a bad looking box - but it's not above average either.

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 12:30 PM
thanks

Sledneck
12-17-2008, 12:30 PM
Lose the strands. Kind of reminds me of finding hair in my food at a restaurant.

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 12:38 PM
Lose the strands. Kind of reminds me of finding hair in my food at a restaurant.

I will not do that at fybo, if you are still in!

Sledneck
12-17-2008, 12:41 PM
I will not do that at fybo, if you are still in!
Yeah but I will be sure to bring some protective gear to wear. With all of the friends you have making out on the circuit I might be at risk of getting hit with some flying objects :tongue:

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 12:51 PM
Don't worry they all hate me until they meet me. I knew you were staying out of that one. I was entertaining myself!

Chipper
12-17-2008, 12:52 PM
I just got my badge yesterday, so I am now certifiable. I'd go with a solid 8.

Mo-Dave
12-17-2008, 12:58 PM
Loses the strands and put more garnish around the front to even it out. The lack of garnish up front and the strands overlapping on the sides is distracting to me. The meat looks good and moist to me, I would probably give it a 6 or 7. You could replace the strands with slices if you want something different in the meat.
Dave

KuyasKitchen
12-17-2008, 01:03 PM
From a layman's perspective ...

The meat looks delicious.

The layout ... average. Other boxes I've seen here look better organized.

The box just doesn't say "eat me now or you'll regret it!" like some of the boxes that were winners did.

cmcadams
12-17-2008, 01:12 PM
I'd go between 7 and 8... so I'd resolve to an 8... lose the strands, like said, center better on the garnish to frame it better... it will look more organized, which is hard to do with pork.

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 01:13 PM
thanks

Bentley
12-17-2008, 01:28 PM
Judge the meat, judge the meat, judge the meat...7-8, did not like the way the color of sauce distracted from meat appearence...Judge the meat..8.

SoEzzy
12-17-2008, 01:53 PM
6 - 7

Increase the garnish, then increase the meat to fill the box out, top and bottom left looks a little sparse, the stringyness could be laid out neater, and an area of bark separate to the chunks might help out.

From a judging point of view, if you want the judges to taste all the styles of meat in the box, give them a chance to obtain their samples as cleanly as possible, being able to pick from the bark, the chunks, and the pulled to put on the judges plate, the cleaner I can do it the higher I'm likely to score the box.

QDoc
12-17-2008, 03:45 PM
6- the chunks are ragged, not enough bark showing, the stringy meat in front does not add to the presentation.

HBMTN
12-17-2008, 04:17 PM
I'd go 7, loose the strands and a little more moist looking ( mainly the one piece bottom right ) and I'd bring it to 8-9

Vince RnQ
12-17-2008, 04:18 PM
I don't know if you've ever considered it but a competition cooking classes might help you with presentation. The class I've been to spent a lot of time on that topic.

As for the box pictured, I'd give it a 6.

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 06:43 PM
I don't know if you've ever considered it but a competition cooking classes might help you with presentation. The class I've been to spent a lot of time on that topic.

As for the box pictured, I'd give it a 6.

I was going to take a class, but have been turned off by most who run them in this area. Waiting to find a good instructor. I have a few in mind, waiting for their schedules to come out.

Thanks for your input

Dan - 3eyzbbq
12-17-2008, 07:02 PM
Hey OC-

Please share. What has turned you off on the classes around the east coast? I think there are a couple good ones to choose from.

BTW - I'd give the box a 6, just nothing special, but not aweful either.

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 07:07 PM
Hey OC-

Please share. What has turned you off on the classes around the east coast? I think there are a couple good ones to choose from.

BTW - I'd give the box a 6, just nothing special, but not aweful either.

I'll take your class if you give one along with many other people in the area. Just a few classes out there that have heard are expensive and thats all they are. I am sorry YankeeBBQ, he will take offense to this even though I am not talking about him.

Dan - 3eyzbbq
12-17-2008, 07:31 PM
I'm waiting for Tuffy to give a class. I'll be the first in line :-D

I thought about giving a class, but it would be geared toward backyard cooks, not comp cooks.

I do recommend the I Smell Smoke Class, it was worth it, for me at least. They really took the time to answer any and all questions. I didn't think the price was too high either. Just my 2 cents.

SaucyWench
12-17-2008, 07:52 PM
I like this thread, from the comments, it looks like I'm on the mark when I'm scoring appearance. As it is, I would probably go 6, maybe 7.

On my monitor, that pork looks moist, but the box is unbalanced. Either leave out the shredded, or frame the chunks with some on the other 3 sides. I find it interesting that one comment was about the color of the sauce, which I don't even see on my monitor. I had to go back to look at the garnish, since I was looking at the meat arrangement. It seems fine, maybe could be neater, but no biggie.

I like Kuya's comment, that's totally what you want, for the meat to say "eat me now!"

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 08:27 PM
I'm waiting for Tuffy to give a class. I'll be the first in line :-D

I thought about giving a class, but it would be geared toward backyard cooks, not comp cooks.

I do recommend the I Smell Smoke Class, it was worth it, for me at least. They really took the time to answer any and all questions. I didn't think the price was too high either. Just my 2 cents.

Tuffy is cool smoke correct?
As far as you go, let me know if you are doing anything, I would attend.
I actually contacted them about their class but I am not sure they want me there after todays events. OH WELL!

Plowboy
12-17-2008, 08:34 PM
I'm actually going to say 5. It looks worse than average. Other than the strands, there seems to be no logic behind the placement at all. It looks a total mess.

If this was 13th, I'm betting that taking the strands out would have put you in top 10. Obviously, it must have been much better than it looks, but appearance couldn't have helped you. Those stringy strands should never make their way to your box. They dry out quickly and are chewy. If a judge took them, your tenderness scores will suffer. The two pieces on the top were probably what helped you the most. They are the pieces I'd grab for. They have bark and will be tender. Those are the right pieces you want in your box.

Long stringy pork is bad ju-ju.

Good luck.

Dale P
12-17-2008, 08:39 PM
Something is in the air. Must be winter and a bad economy combo.

We havent taken a class and we expect to win every contest we enter. If we dont, its Matts fault.

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 08:44 PM
Thanks for everyones input. I will 86 the strands, the pork tasted decent. I was actually surprised on the alsmost decent finish. I will put more thought into placement. Pork here, pork there.

Plowboy
12-17-2008, 08:48 PM
Thanks for everyones input. I will 86 the strands, the pork tasted decent. I was actually surprised on the alsmost decent finish. I will put more thought into placement. Pork here, pork there.

I bet is was fantastic. In the end, taste rules!

Jacked UP BBQ
12-17-2008, 08:49 PM
I bet is was fantastic. In the end, taste rules!

Especially when I stuff my fat arse after turn ins

HeSmellsLikeSmoke
12-17-2008, 08:49 PM
What were your appearance scores?

River City Smokehouse
12-17-2008, 09:15 PM
I give it a 7. I looks dry and I'd like to see more bark. The stringy meat isn't very appealing and catches the eye immediately. I'd suggest a spritz of something at the end. Maybe give it some rub and a bit of sauce and mix it up before you place it in your box. Show a lot of bark. I lie the chinkier meat as ng as it's not too large to eat.

SaucyWench
12-17-2008, 09:18 PM
So, if it looks dry, and the shredded [stringy] meat isn't appealing, why would you give it an above average score?

White Dog BBQ
12-17-2008, 09:51 PM
Hey OC-

Please share. What has turned you off on the classes around the east coast? I think there are a couple good ones to choose from.

BTW - I'd give the box a 6, just nothing special, but not aweful either.

Other than the Guru / I Smell Smoke class, what other classes are regularly held in the Mid-Atlantic area? The only other one I'm aware of was the one at Dover by Fat Angel.

To keep it on topic -- I'd say between 5 and 6. I think food looks more appetizing when presented in an orderly, "put together" fashion.

ihbobry
12-18-2008, 06:26 AM
So, if it looks dry, and the shredded [stringy] meat isn't appealing, why would you give it an above average score?

Because in a public forum people tend score higher and give the benefit of the doubt.

The box looks un-organized drylooking, off center, thrown together. (and so does the meat :wink:)

Looks like you really didn't care. 5

Sledneck
12-18-2008, 07:30 AM
Other than the Guru / I Smell Smoke class, what other classes are regularly held in the Mid-Atlantic area? The only other one I'm aware of was the one at Dover by Fat Angel.
Very few randomly happen up here. I see on the KCBS classes listing that Lotta Bull is doing a class in KC every month of the year in 09. Dover DE has a class listed in April called BBQ 101

Jacked UP BBQ
12-18-2008, 08:03 AM
Thanks for everyones input, does anyone have an example of a cared for, put together box. Not sure how to put pork in a box with love, PLEASE HELP.

HeSmellsLikeSmoke
12-18-2008, 08:54 AM
Thanks for everyones input, does anyone have an example of a cared for, put together box. Not sure how to put pork in a box with love, PLEASE HELP.

Go back and look at Pickled Pig's pork box on another turn in box thread you started. I think it is an outstanding example of love in a box and is one of the best pork boxes I have seen.

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46807&highlight=pork+box

Jacked UP BBQ
12-18-2008, 09:00 AM
I remember those boxes, they look amazing. Thanks for the reminder.

Harbormaster
12-18-2008, 10:57 AM
Yep, those pics that Pickled Pig put up were the inspiration for the pork and brisket boxes I did. I even printed the pics out - in color - and took them to the comp so I didn't have to do it from memory.
Sadly, mine didn't look quite as good as the pics, but we finished 6th in pork and 5th in brisket.

Fat Angel
12-18-2008, 07:40 PM
Dover DE has a class listed in April called BBQ 101[/quote]


The class at Dover is more for beginners, either people that have never cooked or people who have only done a few comps. I cover basic bbq knowledge from a beginners prospective, getting started, smokers, sauces, rubs etc. I then show what I do with my brisket and chicken (even though I came in DAL in our last contest). Jim Boggs from Philly pigs talks about being a veteran comp cook, and then talks about Pork and Ribs. The last part of the class is taught by Rich of Pig Pen bbq and he talks about MIM contests.

It is definitely a good class with a lot of info, but it more for a beginner and is not really hands on like ISS!!!'s class.

I am also looking into taking a class and just waiting to hear for one in the northeast. Yankee, do you have anything scheduled?

BTW: I would give the box a 6.

LindaM
12-19-2008, 06:48 PM
Other than the Guru / I Smell Smoke class, what other classes are regularly held in the Mid-Atlantic area? The only other one I'm aware of was the one at Dover by Fat Angel.

To keep it on topic -- I'd say between 5 and 6. I think food looks more appetizing when presented in an orderly, "put together" fashion.

The Dover Class is not only Fat Angel, it is The Phillly Pigs and Pig Pen BBQ, all teams who consistently do well in competition. Each team is demonstrating what they do best in .

EatonHoggBBQ
12-19-2008, 07:29 PM
All this talk of not including strands of pork in your entry. Couldn't those strands of pork be used as somewhat of an indication to the judge that the pork butt was correctly cooked? Overcooked will not yield those long stringy strands. Personally, those pieces are the first ones I grab when I am judging an entry.

John
KCBS/CBJ

SaucyWench
12-19-2008, 08:00 PM
For me, the strands are fine, and I grab them too. In this box though, they just needed to be arranged differently for the appearance, like kind of framing the chunks instead of just on the one end.

Dan - 3eyzbbq
12-19-2008, 08:39 PM
The Dover Class is not only Fat Angel, it is The Phillly Pigs and Pig Pen BBQ, all teams who consistently do well in competition. Each team is demonstrating what they do best in .

That's certainly good to know. I mean if it was just Fat Angel, what a rip off! :wink:

White Dog BBQ
12-20-2008, 04:22 PM
FYI, I sent an e-mail to Steve Farrin from I Smell Smoke. He said nothing is planned at the moment, but he's sure they'll be planning something soon.

River City Smokehouse
12-26-2008, 04:29 AM
I lie the chinkier meat as ng as it's not too large to eat.
What was I thinking? I was sober too!:eek::biggrin:

It was supposed to say."I like the chunkier meat as long as it's not too large to eat."

Meat Burner
12-26-2008, 11:31 PM
6 only on presentation. That is all it is. This is a "competition" not impressing you neighbors. Bet taste and tenderness was good though! IMHO, the competions turn-is should be better than average. Boy, here we go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jacked UP BBQ
12-27-2008, 11:01 AM
This is a "competition" not impressing you neighbors. Boy, here we go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't get it??

smoke showin'
12-27-2008, 07:09 PM
little more glaze straighten out the strands and brush with sauce , more bark 7