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Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 08:56 AM
Howdy yalls. Not been able to post much since I signed up, but lookin forward to hangin' out here more as I get more desk time.

Been wanting to start a thread about brisket sauce. I like the fact that this forum is more willing to talk about competition details than others. Our team has settled in nicely with every thing we do for three categories. But we've been bouncing around like a superball on brisket sauce for 5 years. The last "brilliant" sauce we have used since Wildwood (where Steve YankeeBBQ tried our brisket and said he didn't like the sauce....but it was the first place brisket). So we stuck with it (despite what Steve said) and it was hit or miss from then on. Then we entered it in the sauce category at the Jack and were second from last. The base of the sauce is reduced beef broth, and it is a pretty subtle sauce...with some tomato, and not real sweet. Think it's time for a change.

This winter I want to work on a new sauce, but wondered.....what do you look for as far as a flavor profile for brisket sauce (if you use it)? Or maybe you use a bottled sauce?

Thanks in advance for your responses!!
Chris

Sledneck
11-14-2008, 09:00 AM
A1 mixed with aujus

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 09:05 AM
A1 mixed with aujus


Store bought au jus, or juice from your brisket??

Never liked A-1, but then again I have not had it in 20 years, and never mixed it with anything.

Thanks mang!
Chris

DC
11-14-2008, 09:11 AM
A1 mixed with aujus

Sledneck

Have you had success using this in competition? I presonally like A1 & aujus but have been reluctant to try this in competition.

Thanks

DC

PatioDaddio
11-14-2008, 09:12 AM
Chris - I have been using my pulled pork sauce thinned with a mixture of beef stock (not broth) and worcestershire sauce. I also add black pepper and a little cayenne to kick it up a couple notches. My scores and walks have increased big time since I started doing this, but who knows if it's the sauce. :wink:

I lightly sauce the back of each slice and so that the flavor of the sauce is there, but it doesn't mess with the appearance. I also sprinkle just a smidge of rub on the sauced side of the slice.

I hope this helps,
John

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 09:15 AM
Chris - I have been using my pulled pork sauce thinned with a mixture of beef stock (not broth) and worcestershire sauce. I also add black pepper and a little cayenne to kick it up a couple notches. My scores and walks have increased big time since I started doing this, but who knows if it's the sauce. :wink:

I lightly sauce the back of each slice and so that the flavor of the sauce is there, but it doesn't mess with the appearance. I also sprinkle just a smidge of rub on the sauced side of the slice.

I hope this helps,
John

Thanks John. I like the idea of giving it some heat. Our pork sauce is really sweet though. Is yours as well?
Thanks again!
Chris

Sledneck
11-14-2008, 09:27 AM
Store bought au jus, or juice from your brisket??

Never liked A-1, but then again I have not had it in 20 years, and never mixed it with anything.

Thanks mang!
ChrisJuice from the brisket

Sledneck

Have you had success using this in competition? I presonally like A1 & aujus but have been reluctant to try this in competition.

Thanks

DCRarely finish outside the top 10 in brisket

PatioDaddio
11-14-2008, 09:29 AM
Our pork sauce is really sweet though. Is yours as well?Yeah, it's pretty sweet, but it also has that vinegar tang to it. Think of it as a cross between Blues Hog original and Tennessee Red, if you're familiar with the taste of those.

As a quick experiment, get some KC Masterpiece Sweet & Tangy (http://www.kcmasterpiece.com/bbq_sweettangy.html) and try this:

1 cup KCM
1/4 cup beef stock (you can also use Campbell's Beef Consomme straight from the can)
2 Tbs Worcestershire
2 tsp Black pepper
1/8 tsp Cayenne

Bring just to a light boil, remove from the heat and let cool.

This will get you really close to mine.

John

Big George's BBQ
11-14-2008, 09:35 AM
I was using one that I received over the internet. Did really well with it @ New Holland. Did horrible @ Dover. My family wants to go back to a sauce I have been tinkering with- not done yet. They said they liked that better. I like some sweetness and some heat to my sauce.

lunchlady
11-14-2008, 09:36 AM
hi chris! good to hear from ya!

we used to make our own brisket sauce, in the beginning, but we weren't very good at brisket AT ALL back then, so we decided to just buy a good sauce and work on technique/cooking. That seems to have worked out pretty good I guess. :>

BUT... we, too, are re-thinking our game plan for next year's brisket sauce. We want to make our own again.

We don't 'oversauce' our brisket either, only the top before we cut it.

Happy Off-Season!

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 09:44 AM
Yeah, it's pretty sweet, but it also has that vinegar tang to it. Think of it as a cross between Blues Hog original and Tennessee Red, if you're familiar with the taste of those.
John

I am familiar with the sauces and the blend, and I have them both. I'll give this a try. I am not much of a whatsdischere sauce fan either. But I can see where it might work with the combo you mention. I do plan on trying a ton of different concoctions.

Thanks again mang! I think I'm gonna like this forum.
Chris

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 09:48 AM
hi chris! good to hear from ya!

we used to make our own brisket sauce, in the beginning, but we weren't very good at brisket AT ALL back then, so we decided to just buy a good sauce and work on technique/cooking. That seems to have worked out pretty good I guess. :>

BUT... we, too, are re-thinking our game plan for next year's brisket sauce. We want to make our own again.

We don't 'oversauce' our brisket either, only the top before we cut it.

Happy Off-Season!

Great to see you here as well. Seems like just a couple weeks ago...oh yeah it was! Anyways, yeah, your brisket was right on at the Jack. Glad I got to try some! Next year, god willing, we'll both be in the same spot, and I'll get the nerve to dig into the magic cooler!
Happy off-season back atchyall.
Chris

Jacked UP BBQ
11-14-2008, 10:17 AM
I use bbq sauce with a homemade stock, heavy on the beef, onions and garlic, very thin and peppery. (very thin consistancy) We do decent in brisket unless we fark up the tenderness.

ique
11-14-2008, 10:27 AM
Wow! A real live thread on competition cooking, imagine that.

I'm not a big fan of beef broth or stock as a finishing sauce (maybe as an injection though). You should already have plenty of beef flavor going on, so I find it to be flat addition. I'm looking for contrast. Also like the sauce to be thin and hot (temperature wise). Try a standard BBQ sauce like head country thinned with water and then perked up with fresh ground black pepper, MSG, and maybe a couple whacks of hot sauce.

Podge
11-14-2008, 10:28 AM
i pretty much rely on the smoke, rub and injection for the brisket, and VERY thin coat of head country on there just so it's "sauced"

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 10:37 AM
Wow! A real live thread on competition cooking, imagine that.

I'm not a big fan of beef broth or stock as a finishing sauce (maybe as an injection though). You should already have plenty of beef flavor going on, so I find it to be flat addition. I'm looking for contrast. Also like the sauce to be thin and hot (temperature wise). Try a standard BBQ sauce like head country thinned with water and then perked up with fresh ground black pepper, MSG, and maybe a couple whacks of hot sauce.


Hey Chris!
Cool. I like that explanation. We too have been using a thin sauce, and not very much of it. Goal being to provide some tang a teeny bit of sweet and some heat, and perhaps slow the flavors down on the judges' tongues. I hadn't thought that beef broth might not be adding anything since the flavor of beef is already there (and prominent).

That really helps. Thanks dude!
Chris

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 10:41 AM
i pretty much rely on the smoke, rub and injection for the brisket, and VERY thin coat of head country on there just so it's "sauced"

Hey Podge. Howzit goin?
That's very much my way of thinking. The brisket already tastes good. The sauce should only compliment and help bring out the flavors you already have....not introduce new flavors (assuming that the meat tastes good to begin with). That's a couple votes for Head Country. I remember it being strong on the liquid smoke though. Guess I'll have to put some on some beef!

Thanks man!
Chris

Scottie
11-14-2008, 11:18 AM
For home use... I really love brisket with Slabs Sauce... I've also been playing a lot with Tabasco Garlic Sauce... Very tasty....

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 11:32 AM
For home use... I really love brisket with Slabs Sauce... I've also been playing a lot with Tabasco Garlic Sauce... Very tasty....


This is not a post about home cooking ;-)

Slabs was one of the sauces we used for a while. We did fairly well with it, but I decided it has too much tang for our brisket.

Tabasco garlic. Dang that sounds purty good.

DMDon
11-14-2008, 11:32 AM
For home use... I really love brisket with Slabs Sauce... I've also been playing a lot with Tabasco Garlic Sauce... Very tasty....


Ok Scottie, what about for competition use.

Scottie
11-14-2008, 11:43 AM
My sponsors banner says Blues Hog... :roll: So that is all I need... Now if you saw my storage room... I've got cases and cases of sauces that I have purchased... For off-season experiments! :icon_shy

I will say Chris. I am playing with the Garlic Tabasco for my comp cooking. But to be honest. I like it so much, I now just pour it all over my slices of brisket. It's the only leftover BBQ I can eat. Either the sliced flat or the point... So what I am working on is how much of it is a good thing for the judges.... But flavor wise.. I think it's outstanding. My girls really like the Tabasco Sweet flavored (sorta like a Tiger Sauce) on their brisket.

PatioDaddio
11-14-2008, 11:52 AM
I wonder how a red eye sauce would work. I just got this recipe in an e-mail from Weber.

1 tablespoon unsalted butter
2 teaspoons minced shallot
1 teaspoon minced garlic
1/2 cup ketchup
1/4 cup brewed dark-roast coffee or espresso
1 tablespoon balsamic vinegar
1 tablespoon brown sugar
2 teaspoons ground ancho chile powder

John

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 12:06 PM
I wonder how a red eye sauce would work. I just got this recipe in an e-mail from Weber.

1 tablespoon unsalted butter
2 teaspoons minced shallot
1 teaspoon minced garlic
1/2 cup ketchup
1/4 cup brewed dark-roast coffee or espresso
1 tablespoon balsamic vinegar
1 tablespoon brown sugar
2 teaspoons ground ancho chile powder

John

In my mind those flavors would all work nicely with beef. Slight tang from the balsamic and ketchup, but everyhing else offering round and earthy flavors. Betchya it needs a little more sweet though. Hmm. Interestin. Thanks for that.
Chris

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 12:09 PM
My sponsors banner says Blues Hog... :roll: So that is all I need... Now if you saw my storage room... I've got cases and cases of sauces that I have purchased... For off-season experiments! :icon_shy

I will say Chris. I am playing with the Garlic Tabasco for my comp cooking. But to be honest. I like it so much, I now just pour it all over my slices of brisket. It's the only leftover BBQ I can eat. Either the sliced flat or the point... So what I am working on is how much of it is a good thing for the judges.... But flavor wise.. I think it's outstanding. My girls really like the Tabasco Sweet flavored (sorta like a Tiger Sauce) on their brisket.

Yo Scottie. I really liked that sweet tabasco too. In fact it's gone and I can't find it at the grocery. I'll keep my eyes peeled for the garlic.
Beers!
CHris

Jacked UP BBQ
11-14-2008, 12:14 PM
I used a white balsamic glaze with some brown sugar, pepper, salt, and garlic. It tasted awesome. I think it placed 17th out of around fifty teams. Could have been a little more tender.

NelsonC
11-14-2008, 12:23 PM
Although my brisket didn't score well last time, I think that was a function of tenderness and not taste. My theory across the board is to stay with consistent flavors between my rub and sauce, so my sauces have always been flavored primarily with the rub that I used on the meat. At the moment my favorite brisket rub has been the Dizzy Pig Cowlick rub, so thats what I've been using in my sauce. My competition sauce recipie was as follows:

1 cup ketchup
1/2 cup cider vinegar
1/3 cup turbinado sugar
1 tablespoon Molasses
1 tablespoon worchestershire sauce
1 tablespoon Hard Times Cafe XXX hot sauce
1 1/2 tablespoons Dizzy Pig Cowlick Rub
1/4 c of drippings from the brisket (preferably seperated of fat).

Combine all ingredients, simmer on low for approx 75% until it has reduced by 25%

Scottie
11-14-2008, 12:27 PM
Yo Scottie. I really liked that sweet tabasco too. In fact it's gone and I can't find it at the grocery. I'll keep my eyes peeled for the garlic.
Beers!
CHris

when I was down for Hammond in the Spring, we went over to Avery Island and the tour of the Tabasco grounds. I got this table top rack that had maybe 8 different Tabasco products in the rack. I liked the garlic so much, I bought a gallon bottle of it from them. yep, a whole gallon... :icon_smil So if you can't find it, I know their store carries all of their products.

The Sweet Tabasco is awesome on eggs!!!

http://countrystore.tabasco.com/prodinfo.asp?number=00052

arlieque
11-14-2008, 12:41 PM
Scottie, great to see you supporting a KCBS sponsor. That is great.

Scottie
11-14-2008, 12:46 PM
I did not have the 50 off coupon though. As they weren't a KCBS sponsor back when I was at their plant on Avery Island... Damn, I guess I missed the boat on that sponsorship... :twisted:

roastntoast
11-14-2008, 12:55 PM
Has anybody tried the "Smoked Chipoltly Tobasco". It works really good on Beef too.

Jules

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 01:05 PM
Although my brisket didn't score well last time, I think that was a function of tenderness and not taste. My theory across the board is to stay with consistent flavors between my rub and sauce, so my sauces have always been flavored primarily with the rub that I used on the meat. At the moment my favorite brisket rub has been the Dizzy Pig Cowlick rub, so thats what I've been using in my sauce. My competition sauce recipie was as follows:

1 cup ketchup
1/2 cup cider vinegar
1/3 cup turbinado sugar
1 tablespoon Molasses
1 tablespoon worchestershire sauce
1 tablespoon Hard Times Cafe XXX hot sauce
1 1/2 tablespoons Dizzy Pig Cowlick Rub
1/4 c of drippings from the brisket (preferably seperated of fat).

Combine all ingredients, simmer on low for approx 75% until it has reduced by 25%

Sounds good Nelson. Thanks for that. Looks pretty interestin. I had molasses in my brisket sauce too, and kinda like what it did....then started thinking it tasted a little too malty. But 1 TBSP is much less than I was using. Will try this. Guess you grind up the cow lick fine?

Hmm. Now I am gonna have to cook up a brisket before the comp to get some au jus. At the comps we don't wrap our brisket until it goes in the cambro, and we only end up with a couple tbsp of fat in the foil.


Thanks for sharing your recipe, and good to hear you are using cow lick!
Beers
Chris

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
11-14-2008, 01:06 PM
I see some posts that refrence "sweet", I have always tried a more savory approch with brisket. maybe thats were I am going wrong. did o.k. in WVA with spicy bbq sauce mixed with the brisket juice. great thread, keep the ideas coming..

Sal

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 01:08 PM
Has anybody tried the "Smoked Chipoltly Tobasco". It works really good on Beef too.

Jules

Hey Jules
My team mate Chuck loves the chipotle tabasco and uses it in his brisket sauce at home. That's on my list of things to try in my all new 2009 brisket sauce. Cool to read all the responses. Yooz guys truly are Bretheren around here.

Cheers mang!
Chris

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 01:12 PM
I see some posts that refrence "sweet", I have always tried a more savory approch with brisket. maybe thats were I am going wrong. did o.k. in WVA with spicy bbq sauce mixed with the brisket juice. great thread, keep the ideas coming..

Sal

Naw. I wouldn't say savory is a problem Sal. Especially on beef. Our only sweet is in the sauce, and it's real thin. We've also been more savory in our approach, but know lots of cooks that go sweeter and do well.

Be well dewd!
Chris

Nature Boy
11-14-2008, 01:15 PM
I used a white balsamic glaze with some brown sugar, pepper, salt, and garlic. It tasted awesome. I think it placed 17th out of around fifty teams. Could have been a little more tender.


That sounds simple and good. So, just a reduction of white balsamic sugar ans spices? Hmm. But dang....white balsamic?? Don't recall ever seeing it. Balsamic made with white wine?

Thanks
Chris

Jacked UP BBQ
11-14-2008, 01:31 PM
That sounds simple and good. So, just a reduction of white balsamic sugar ans spices? Hmm. But dang....white balsamic?? Don't recall ever seeing it. Balsamic made with white wine?

Thanks
Chris

They should have it at any food store in your area. Check it out, very tasty. Sometimes they have the reduction already made. It is very pricy but very conveinent. 20.00 for like 3 oz.

ThomEmery
11-14-2008, 04:49 PM
Q sauce from QN4U is the standard for Brisket turn ins out here

Brauma
11-14-2008, 06:37 PM
Great thread. Thanks for starting this discussion Chris.

Dan - 3eyzbbq
11-14-2008, 08:04 PM
Chris-

Sounds like you need a taste testing party. Cook a couple briskets with the different sauces and have some people over. Heck, I'll even invite myself :-P

I'm thinking of reworking my sauce too. Problem is, thats as far as I've gotten so far..

Mike - CSBBBQ
11-14-2008, 08:18 PM
Chris, what weekend are we tasting:-)))) Thanks for starting the thread. Hope all is well!

Hey Dan 3eyz give me a call 301 two three seven 4588.

Brauma
11-14-2008, 08:49 PM
A party??!! :icon_clown You're so generous Chris. I'll bring the Legend Brown. :wink:

barbefunkoramaque
11-14-2008, 08:49 PM
angelo's pit sauce in the store.

Not the bottled stuff

SmokeInDaEye
11-14-2008, 09:40 PM
Interesting discussion. Saucing brisket is one area that I pay zero attention to. I've always figured cooking it right doesn't warrant much more. That's not to say I won't be playing with some things to step up my game over the winter!

PatioDaddio
11-14-2008, 11:49 PM
Interesting discussion. Saucing brisket is one area that I pay zero attention to. I've always figured cooking it right doesn't warrant much more. That's not to say I won't be playing with some things to step up my game over the winter!Apparently you are paying attention to this "Comp Brisket Sauce" thread. :shock: :wink: Just bustin' your chops, of course.

John

Michael in PA
11-15-2008, 12:33 AM
In my opinion, the best briskets I ever cooked were a little sweet, with a gentle heat and a complex savory background. Can something be sweet and savory at the same time? Anyway, this all comes from the rub. I don't sauce brisket. And I really, really like our sauce, especially on burnt endz.

I also rarely use foil. Briskets come out and are sliced after a very short rest. To my mind there's something magical about that crispy fat/rub crust that gets lost in the foil or under sauce. But that's just my opinion and my credentials are a little thin.

Big George's BBQ
11-15-2008, 06:31 AM
Hey Chris I like the idea of a taste party

pigmaker23
11-15-2008, 07:17 AM
Sauce, you guys put sauce on brisket ? wow i knew I missing something :-P

VA BBQ PIRATES
11-15-2008, 07:49 AM
We've used a home made sauce and used a couple different comercial sauces in different combinations. What has been consistant is we always thin it down with the de-fatted juices from the foil and we add Boneyard Brew Hot Sauce for heat and apply it thinly. (Sometimes it gets some of that stuff from the magic blue bottle too :wink:)

Let us know when the first annual Nature Boy Brisketfest is!

Tom

Rick's Tropical Delight
11-15-2008, 07:59 AM
Sauce, you guys put sauce on brisket ? wow i knew I missing something :-P

i'm with ya! you're supposed to sauce the brisket? :shock:

Sledneck
11-15-2008, 08:34 AM
. What has been consistant is we always thin it down with the de-fatted juices from the foil a
TomFat is flavor!!!!

VA BBQ PIRATES
11-15-2008, 08:55 AM
Fat is flavor!!!!

I'm trying to avoid a "greasy" mouth feel. Maybe I'll rethink that.

Tom

BBQ_Mayor
11-15-2008, 09:29 AM
I think you can use just about any sauce as long as the brisket is cooked just right. I've used all different kinds of sauce, all falling in the top ten at comps.
Sauces I've used: Head Country, Blues Hog, Rasp. Chilpote, Watermelon sauce, and just the brisket juice with some beef broth.
I really like the Rasp. Chilpotle sauce but sometimes judges don't care for the fruity flavors.

swamprb
11-15-2008, 09:33 AM
Yo Scottie. I really liked that sweet tabasco too. In fact it's gone and I can't find it at the grocery. I'll keep my eyes peeled for the garlic.
Beers!
CHris


How about an alternative to Tabasco? Have you tried any of the Cajun Power Sauces? The Original Garlic Sauce and the Spicy Garlic Pepper Sauce I can get off the grocery shelf, and they are pretty damn good, and the Marinating Basting sauce looks interesting?

http://www.cajunpowersauce.com/products.cfm?c=08D960F1-F42E-BF06-519F031468853216

SmokeInDaEye
11-15-2008, 12:00 PM
Apparently you are paying attention to this "Comp Brisket Sauce" thread. :shock: :wink: Just bustin' your chops, of course.

John

Hee hee! Some of my best comp ideas have come from paying attention to many threads here. These folks are a wealth of knowledge.

SMITTYtheSMOKER
11-15-2008, 02:42 PM
We have found that the right piece of meat, on the right cooker, using the best rub we can make...gets us in the top 10 often enough with no sauce needed.

SaucyWench
11-15-2008, 04:39 PM
I agree, great brisket needs no sauce!

Jacked UP BBQ
11-15-2008, 06:26 PM
I agree with most saying brisket does not need sauce. We have done better without sauce. We have done decent with sauce also. I don't know why I change our technique so much. I am just an experimental mudder bucker. I like the look of brisket when you dip in a thin sauce and pull it out, it looks much better in the box. Looks moist, and is moist. A lot of times we had no sauce the brisket was moist but looked dry. So what I am saying is that they eat with their eyes first. So if it looks moist, in their head before it gets to their mouths. It is moist. Catch my drift!

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
11-15-2008, 06:44 PM
I agree with most saying brisket does not need sauce. We have done better without sauce. We have done decent with sauce also. I don't know why I change our technique so much. I am just an experimental mudder bucker. I like the look of brisket when you dip in a thin sauce and pull it out, it looks much better in the box. Looks moist, and is moist. A lot of times we had no sauce the brisket was moist but looked dry. So what I am saying is that they eat with their eyes first. So if it looks moist, in their head before it gets to their mouths. It is moist. Catch my drift!

I agree for the most part, but a little extra flavor cant hurt (can it?)

Meat Burner
11-15-2008, 06:48 PM
OC's response sounds pretty good. Adding a little flavor with a nice thin sauce is no different than adding a little flavor with your rub. As long as I know it is brisket, I will try to score it accordingly. Rub is basically just a dry sauce applied during the long cooking process. It is there to add flavor. Hopefully, just the perfect flavor we are all looking for. Just my thought on it.

BurntFinger_Jason
11-15-2008, 08:18 PM
I agree, great brisket needs no sauce!

Agreed. Sauce is used to cover up mistakes, imo. Let the beef speak for itself.

Podge
11-15-2008, 08:23 PM
I'm trying to avoid a "greasy" mouth feel. Maybe I'll rethink that.

Tom

Fat can also gel up.

Michael in PA
11-15-2008, 10:46 PM
A lot of times we had no sauce the brisket was moist but looked dry. So what I am saying is that they eat with their eyes first. So if it looks moist, in their head before it gets to their mouths. It is moist. Catch my drift!

We break down packers to well trimmed flats and points plus one whole brisket. When the flats are done we pull everything including the packer. Then we seperate the packer and use some of the fat to gently rub down each slice of flat. The result is nice, moist looking slices of flat without any added sauce.

Big George's BBQ
11-16-2008, 06:26 AM
A little sauce with some brisket drippings can give a nice shine to the Brisket when you cut it and put it into the boxs. Put it on before you cot it and put back in the smoker for a few minutes

bbqczar
11-16-2008, 02:02 PM
Q sauce from QN4U is the standard for Brisket turn ins out here

Problem is that you can't get it anymore :cry: