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View Full Version : I need a rib coach for comp style spares


Jacked UP BBQ
10-27-2008, 10:51 AM
:lol:Please someone tell me something. I thought I produced the best ribs I could this weekend and obviously it was not good enough. Perfectly cooked, Nice glaze, nice ring, great flavor. But once again it could have been subjective to my taste. No over powering flavors, just damn good meat. Please help it is killing me, that I feel I am missing something.:icon_sick:arrow::grin:

Scottie
10-27-2008, 11:09 AM
I would recommend a I Smell Smoke!!! cooking class...

watg?
10-27-2008, 11:27 AM
I would second that motion. Several teams that took the class this past June have improved their rib scores.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-27-2008, 11:29 AM
I tried about six months ago and they told me that they had no classes in the future, do you know where I can find that info. Thanks

mds2
10-27-2008, 11:30 AM
Where are you located?

Edit: When you aren't at the strip club?

Jacked UP BBQ
10-27-2008, 11:36 AM
NJ born and bread

watg?
10-27-2008, 11:37 AM
I tried about six months ago and they told me that they had no classes in the future, do you know where I can find that info. Thanks



Keep an eye on ISS website and also the BBQ Guru site, or you can ask YankeeBBQ to let you know when they get another class scheduled. He is a frequent visitor here.

BBQSMYBFF
10-27-2008, 11:40 AM
Maybe you should stop it with all that stupid bookaky rubbin you do with your meat...

or maybe buy yourself an fec100.. then you can have it all figured out.. i am offering classes tonight with some ribs if you want to stop by.. got about 4 people going to be there...

hopefully it will be good enough for the dogs to eat!!

but stop on by.. anytime....

you know where!! :lol::lol::lol::lol:

Scottie
10-27-2008, 11:41 AM
I think Steve will owe me a cut... Or a lobstah.... :roll:

YankeeBBQ
10-28-2008, 08:31 AM
We don't have any classes scheduled right now. We'll probably do something in the spring.

Dan - 3eyzbbq
10-28-2008, 08:46 AM
Hey OC-

Why not post what you did and let people critique?

If you keep it simple with ribs you'll do good.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 11:15 AM
Hey OC-

Why not post what you did and let people critique?

If you keep it simple with ribs you'll do good.


Here it goes - St louis style ribs removed membrane and all the fat all over the top, they looked nice.

Rubbed with a light glaze of grey poupon and put a nice even coat of hen and hog, added some sea salt over top. Le them sit for about five hours.

Smoked them over apple, cherry, and hickory for four hours, spraying every 30 minutes with applejuice.

For the last hour we put a nice glaze of blues hog sauce over them, not to heavy, you were still able to see the beautiful bark.

With fifteen minutes left, we put a finishing glaze of blues hog and aj.

Sliced and served those thick juicy biothces and got horrible scores according to the flavor and look, they tasted awesome. Let me know what you guys think. Thanks

ihbobry
10-28-2008, 11:37 AM
Let me know what you guys think. Thanks

I don't think I'll ever be comfortable giving advice but I think you are way to busy.

You have so much going on, I'd start from scratch and rebuild the recipe keeping it simple. You have 4 sauces and 3 woods? Plus an apple spray? Smoke with one wood then the other till you know what each is doing, not 3 @ a time.

Plus what's your cook time? Do you foil? When? Temps?

Cue's Your Daddy
10-28-2008, 11:42 AM
i thought u and your brother didnt use commercial bbq sauce or rubs?

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 11:46 AM
i thought u and your brother didnt use commercial bbq sauce or rubs?

first try at a comp, just started, i figured I would go main stream, look where it got me!:cry::lol:

Cue's Your Daddy
10-28-2008, 11:51 AM
Thats Funny.. see and everyone got on you for that Dont worry my ribs sucked as my placing showed, but a judge gave me a 9/8/8.. I want to meet this judge and tell him he is clueless. MY RIBS STUNK. Sounds pretty good to me. How were your taste scores.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 11:56 AM
rib scores from this weekend
779 865 777 876 766 889

YankeeBBQ
10-28-2008, 12:03 PM
rib scores from this weekend
779 865 777 876 766 889

Looks like 4 of the six judges didn't think they were perfectly cooked. I'm not familiar with the rub you used so I can't comment on it. I'd avoid adding salt at the beginning of a cook especially 5 hours before going on the cooker. I think ribs can get a hammy texture if they are rubbed too early.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 12:06 PM
I am still trying to figure out the perfect cooked rib! There is a fine line between pull off and to tough. That's why I need someone to show me. I think our ribs are good and I have no idea what more I can do. Maybe FAB-P, ewwwwww did I say that!

Scottie
10-28-2008, 12:11 PM
Looks like 4 of the six judges didn't think they were perfectly cooked. I'm not familiar with the rub you used so I can't comment on it. I'd avoid adding salt at the beginning of a cook especially 5 hours before going on the cooker. I think ribs can get a hammy texture if they are rubbed too early.

I agree. I am not even sure if you use the proper rub, that you need to add additional salt anyway. I am always fearful of the hammy or salt lick that ribs can become.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 12:12 PM
The rub actually has no salt in it at all, according to the maker.

Spydermike72
10-28-2008, 12:13 PM
OC, like a few of the others said I think you may be trying to do too much. Also rubbing 5 hours before cooking may be a bit too long, try 30mins or so.. What kind of cooker are you using ? Spraying every 30 mins may be too often, but I am only going on my own experience. The old saying "if your looking you aint cooking" applies here. Just my thoughts with the info you provided...

YankeeBBQ
10-28-2008, 12:16 PM
The rub actually has no salt in it at all, according to the maker.


Really ? Well then maybe you didn't put enough salt LOL. Without having tried the ribs it's hard to give advice to improve them.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 12:25 PM
I must not have added enough salt!!!!:) I am cooking on a spicewine.

Sledneck
10-28-2008, 12:31 PM
Maybe you should of listened to me last week and retired from comp cooking:tongue:

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
10-28-2008, 12:32 PM
OC, like a few of the others said I think you may be trying to do too much. Also rubbing 5 hours before cooking may be a bit too long, try 30mins or so.. What kind of cooker are you using ? Spraying every 30 mins may be too often, but I am only going on my own experience. The old saying "if your looking you aint cooking" applies here. Just my thoughts with the info you provided...

this may sound crazy but , I have been rubbing my ribs 12-14 hours in advance, I make my own rubs so I know there is very little salt in it. I actually have done o.k. with them this past year, a 2nd and 3rd in 6 comps. I cook them for about 6 hours total. I guess my question is...is 30 min. enough?

thanks for any advice!

Sal

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 12:42 PM
Maybe you should of listened to me last week and retired from comp cooking:tongue:


What place did you get in pork??? Sucks thats all I can say:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap

YankeeBBQ
10-28-2008, 12:49 PM
this may sound crazy but , I have been rubbing my ribs 12-14 hours in advance, I make my own rubs so I know there is very little salt in it. I actually have done o.k. with them this past year, a 2nd and 3rd in 6 comps. I cook them for about 6 hours total. I guess my question is...is 30 min. enough?

thanks for any advice!

Sal

We rub ours about 10 minutes before they go on the cooker. At least 3 firsts this year and 6th at the Jack. So yeah 30 minutes is plenty in my opinion.

Sledneck
10-28-2008, 12:51 PM
What place did you get in pork??? Sucks thats all I can say:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap
well if the kcbs listened to unforgiven I would of won in pork:rolleyes:

Fatback Joe
10-28-2008, 12:55 PM
Sliced and served those thick juicy biothces

How thick were they??

I am far from a "seasoned" competitor having only done 5 comps, but I have been in the top 10 in ribs in all but one contest and in that contest, I used ribs that were thicker than "normal".

Dale P
10-28-2008, 01:08 PM
:-DTry making your own mustard and put it on thick as you can handle!:idea:just a thought. My Dad used to make the best.

My advice is to experiment at least once a week with a different recipe every cook until you get something you think can be at least top 10. Cook all the time, experimenting as you go with something different everytime until you get something great. Many here have taken classes and cant just give you their recipe. Jmho but learning from your own experiments is rewarding. Buy a cryo of ribs and do each slab different speeds up this process.
That"ll be $8.95 payable to:The BBQ Brethren C/O Poobah:mrgreen:

Sledneck
10-28-2008, 01:10 PM
I never understood the whole mustard thing

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 01:13 PM
I never understood the whole mustard thing


Try ketchup

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 01:14 PM
:-DTry making your own mustard and put it on thick as you can handle!:idea:just a thought. My Dad used to make the best.

My advice is to experiment at least once a week with a different recipe every cook until you get something you think can be at least top 10. Cook all the time, experimenting as you go with something different everytime until you get something great. Many here have taken classes and cant just give you their recipe. Jmho but learning from your own experiments is rewarding. Buy a cryo of ribs and do each slab different speeds up this process.
That"ll be $8.95 payable to:The BBQ Brethren C/O Poobah:mrgreen:

Thanks for the tips. My only problem is that I obviously do not know top ten ribs. I think a lot of times I will get top ten and I get 27th!

BurntFinger_Jason
10-28-2008, 01:34 PM
I never understood the whole mustard thing

IMO it's just an easy way to vinegar into the meat. The thicker consistentcy sticks better than a thinned out liquid, and also helps form a bark.

Dale P
10-28-2008, 01:34 PM
Judging is the answer to that top ten question I guess. The best we ever made was a 2nd place against some strong teams and those ribs came from a drunken experiment that we knew just taste real good, nice texture, wasnt black as an 8 ball. You know what I mean?

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 01:58 PM
Judging is the answer to that top ten question I guess. The best we ever made was a 2nd place against some strong teams and those ribs came from a drunken experiment that we knew just taste real good, nice texture, wasnt black as an 8 ball. You know what I mean?

Sounds like all I need to do is get wasted and shoot up to newark for an 8ball!!!!!:lol::lol:

Dale P
10-28-2008, 02:11 PM
The ribs i had the pleasure of trying at the Jack were unbelievable. I have to guess that grey poupon wasnt anywhere close to that site.:razz:

6- average
9- excellent
big difference OC.

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
10-28-2008, 02:16 PM
We rub ours about 10 minutes before they go on the cooker. At least 3 firsts this year and 6th at the Jack. So yeah 30 minutes is plenty in my opinion.


thanks!! I will try a couple of racks rubbing right before I cook them the next practice and see how they turn out!! maybe thats why mine arent as consistant as I would like! thanks again!!

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 02:20 PM
The ribs i had the pleasure of trying at the Jack were unbelievable. I have to guess that grey poupon wasnt anywhere close to that site.:razz:

6- average
9- excellent
big difference OC.

Not sure what you are saying?:icon_smil

BBQSMYBFF
10-28-2008, 02:23 PM
Maybe you should of listened to me last week and retired from comp cooking:tongue:


maybe sled really won because he was thinking of me all weekend!!!

cant get me out of your mind eh?!? lol :lol:

Dale P
10-28-2008, 02:47 PM
OC I am saying that a good average rib probably wont get you a top 10. They need to be 9s - excellent. Many of the teams are turning in above average slabs anyhow. We used to make 27th place ribs, so i have a handle on what you are doing since I have cooked many just OK ribs and finally started cooking some better product. We owe it all to research on forums & practice. When I say research that doesnt mean using a recipe straight out of a book. We throw in some ideas of our own and hope what we do will make our boxes better then everyone elses.
I cant explain things very well sometimes but I tried.

Podge
10-28-2008, 02:50 PM
I personally haven't bought a bottle of mustard in 4 years. Mustard makes a great barrier for the rub not to soak in the meat.. IMO.

Podge
10-28-2008, 02:52 PM
We rub ours about 10 minutes before they go on the cooker. At least 3 firsts this year and 6th at the Jack. So yeah 30 minutes is plenty in my opinion.

and you've gotten first at the jack in ribs a couple of years ago:razz:.. I like to set mine out for a bit longer than 10 minutes, until the ribs look wet and the rub looks well attached.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 02:56 PM
OC I am saying that a good average rib probably wont get you a top 10. They need to be 9s - excellent. Many of the teams are turning in above average slabs anyhow. We used to make 27th place ribs, so i have a handle on what you are doing since I have cooked many just OK ribs and finally started cooking some better product. We owe it all to research on forums & practice. When I say research that doesnt mean using a recipe straight out of a book. We throw in some ideas of our own and hope what we do will make our boxes better then everyone elses.
I cant explain things very well sometimes but I tried.

I hear ya now. I am trying to put together some good stuff but I hear so many different things from what you are saying to be very simple and you will do better. So to me it makes me feel like it is a crap shoot. I know its not but until I perfect something that works, I will be confused. Do they want flavorful, some say yes some say no, do they want spicy some say yes some say no, do they want sweet everyone says yes. To many mixed idea when it comes to ribs. I think imo that this is the most of all subjective category. Please don't yell at me.

Dale P
10-28-2008, 02:57 PM
I tried horseradish mustard once. For real. I just had to know. Now i know.

OC we turn in what we think taste good and hope that the whole table agrees with us. Stupid maybe, but that is one of our policies.

Rightstuff
10-28-2008, 03:09 PM
We've only completed 2 comps but we placed 4th in ribs both times. However, I've been cooking ribs a while. This is what I do. Rub the ribs about 2 hours prior to smoking. Smoke for 3 hours (no spray, no looking). Wrap in foil for 1.5 - 2.0 hours. Unwrap, glaze and smoke until done. I use the bend and touch method to determine doneness. I smoke with pure hickory. I've kept it quite simple and it seems to work quite well. I think our presentation has hurt us though! Also, I do practice cooks with different rubs and glazes to try different flavor profiles.

Rightstuff
10-28-2008, 03:17 PM
Do they want flavorful, some say yes some say no, do they want spicy some say yes some say no, do they want sweet everyone says yes. To many mixed idea when it comes to ribs. I think imo that this is the most of all subjective category. Please don't yell at me.

I've talked to judges and chefs and asked what they think makes a great rib. I get the same response. Flavor profiles! A good balance of flavors. Nothing dominates (ie smoke, spiciness, sweetness, etc) but they all work together. I know its somewhat vague, but it does make sense.

Sledneck
10-28-2008, 03:23 PM
maybe sled really won because he was thinking of me all weekend!!!

cant get me out of your mind eh?!? lol :lol:
Yep that must be it. Either that or i was to busy laughing that you weren't allowed to go:tongue:

Dale P
10-28-2008, 03:43 PM
I've talked to judges and chefs and asked what they think makes a great rib. I get the same response. Flavor profiles! A good balance of flavors. Nothing dominates (ie smoke, spiciness, sweetness, etc) but they all work together. I know its somewhat vague, but it does make sense.


That is a great answer.:eusa_clap

oceanpigassassins
10-28-2008, 05:03 PM
Everybody seems to say the same thing basic is the best when it comes to bbq

Podge
10-28-2008, 05:20 PM
Everybody seems to say the same thing basic is the best when it comes to bbq

Basic, Bold, Balanced BBQ.

Spydermike72
10-28-2008, 05:21 PM
Everybody seems to say the same thing basic is the best when it comes to bbq

For a comp yes, for the most part. You dont want to overpower the meat with either the sauce or the rub.

Now for my personal eats, I like the spicy stuff and that is when I use the spicy rub and try other things.

For a Comp I was once told by a very wise man that consistency is the key.

oceanpigassassins
10-28-2008, 06:42 PM
The other thing that gets me is these judges.How do you get bad scores from some and all the others give you give scores

TELL YOU WHAT BBQ
10-28-2008, 07:18 PM
The other thing that gets me is these judges.How do you get bad scores from some and all the others give you give scores

OC, QYBA!! (QUITYERBELLYACHIN'!) :wink: Get out and cook!

It's 'SMOKE' and it's SUBJECTIVE. It ain't science (well sorta) and the judges will NEVER be uniform. KCBS 'training' does not negate subjectivity.

This IS supposed to be fun...sometimes.:icon_pissed

watg?
10-28-2008, 07:44 PM
The other thing that gets me is these judges.How do you get bad scores from some and all the others give you give scores



The low score is dropped, they keep the high score, believe it or not, it seems to work.:wink: Now, if you get two low scores, dropping one helps a little, but it also tells you something, at least in my humble opinion. Make adjustments and try to improve.:-D

When I look at our scores, I drop the low and the high to try and get a real feel of what the majority thought.Then move on from there.

Rightstuff
10-28-2008, 07:51 PM
KCBS 'training' does not negate subjectivity.

Thats pretty much it!

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 08:53 PM
just for the record there are two of us on here!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

oceanpigassassins
10-28-2008, 09:08 PM
We do get out there and cook (tell you what bbq)

Jacked UP BBQ
10-28-2008, 09:11 PM
It is official Mike - you are addicted to the site. I am surprised they didn't tell you to get over to cattle call and introduce yourself. They must think you are me! You better get over there before Jorge gets you!!!!!

BRBBQ
10-28-2008, 09:15 PM
Your rib scores show at least three 7's for appearance, post some pics maybe we'll see something on presentation.

Muzzlebrake
10-28-2008, 09:33 PM
sign up for a good class being taught by someone that is having success on the comp circuit.
Its hard to beat a good class taught by a good instructor. Try to find one that includes you cooking along with the instructor
I think Chris Hart from iCue may be doing one in our area sometime over the winter. If so, I will see you there. You stop in Newark and I will CL up some entertainment...:twisted:

Jacked UP BBQ
10-29-2008, 09:18 AM
Does anyone glaze the inside of the meat with sauce before turn in?

Rightstuff
10-29-2008, 09:39 AM
Does anyone glaze the inside of the meat with sauce before turn in?

We use a 50/50 ratio water and sauce and very lightly coat everything.

Sledneck
10-29-2008, 09:45 AM
Does anyone glaze the inside of the meat with sauce before turn in?Nope

BBQSMYBFF
10-29-2008, 12:43 PM
nope


oh i know.. You lick it, suck it, rub it down, and turn it in.. Lol hahaha

Dan - 3eyzbbq
10-29-2008, 01:09 PM
OC-

My 2cents. I don't think the mustard is hurting, stick with that. Keep the salt if the rub doesn't have any, but rub 10-30 minutes prior to going on the cooker. Use 2 woods, maybe hickory and apple with a 50/50 ratio. Ditch the apple juice spray entirely. Put the sauce on the last 30 minutes or so, I think your putting it on too early. Cook them till the rack bends but doesn't crack or break when you pick them up with tongs.

And, experiment, experiment, experiment.

Jacked UP BBQ
10-29-2008, 01:20 PM
thanks guys

butts a fire
10-29-2008, 01:25 PM
Don't know how much this will help but I would start with the 3-2-1 method on the ribs and adjust your cooking time from there based on how they turn out. I use apple wood mixed with a little Hickory for comps. I would try changing up the rub or the sauce and see if that makes a difference with the flavor profile maybe they aren't meshing well together.

Another thing to consider would be switching to Babybacks they are what I use for comps because they suit my cooking style maybe they will do better for you.

ique
10-29-2008, 02:25 PM
I think Chris Hart from iQue may be doing one in our area sometime over the winter.

Yup, I'm working with Phil on a cooking class that looks like we'll do in combination with a KCBS judge certification class. Somewhere in the NYC/Long Island area in early 09. I'll be demo-ing my full procedure for a KCBS contest. Also will work hands-on with students who want to run a cook on their own equipment. We'll have segments on Chefs Choice/Grilling and possibly Catering 101.

Comp style spares and bite-through chicken skin will be covered :)

Jacked UP BBQ
10-29-2008, 02:43 PM
I will be there

TELL YOU WHAT BBQ
10-29-2008, 03:45 PM
i-que... Sounds great! Tell You What -- You Tell Me When!!

Thanks.

OC---I KNOW you guys practice... I was being cranky last nite. I'm envious -- I don't SMOKE during DEER season. Seems them critters seem to equate the 'subtle blue smoke smell' with their A$S err...RUMP... wrapped in BACON surrounded by LOW & SLOW!

CTSmokehouse
10-29-2008, 04:31 PM
Yup, I'm working with Phil on a cooking class that looks like we'll do in combination with a KCBS judge certification class. Somewhere in the NYC/Long Island area in early 09. I'll be demo-ing my full procedure for a KCBS contest. Also will work hands-on with students who want to run a cook on their own equipment. We'll have segments on Chefs Choice/Grilling and possibly Catering 101.

Comp style spares and bite-through chicken skin will be covered :)


Sounds great!! Count me in please...

Yours in BBQ,

Cliff

Jacked UP BBQ
10-30-2008, 11:06 AM
what do you think

Sledneck
10-30-2008, 11:12 AM
they look good

Jacked UP BBQ
10-30-2008, 11:15 AM
they look good

thanks they must taste like chit with the scores they got

BBQSMYBFF
10-30-2008, 11:21 AM
thanks they must taste like chit with the scores they got


doubt that one.. but they do look good. i am sure you did some re arranging with the ribs before you turned it in but they do look nice..

very nice color, look alike and just plain ol good!! man i wish i could suck on some of them!!

oceanpigassassins
10-30-2008, 12:55 PM
I heard you can suuck the meat right off the bone in one shot

watg?
10-30-2008, 04:00 PM
I heard you can suuck the meat right off the bone in one shot


If the meat came right off the bone like that, would'nt they be considered overdone?:lol::twisted:

Sledneck
10-30-2008, 04:16 PM
If the meat came right off the bone like that, would'nt they be considered overdone?:lol::twisted:Depends on the judge:rolleyes:

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
10-30-2008, 07:17 PM
Depends on the judge:rolleyes:

again, what judges are looking for. take a judging class and find out. ribs, take a bite and only the "mouth bite area " should be removed. not all of that side. I may or may not agree butt.... its the criteria...

Jacked UP BBQ
10-31-2008, 11:35 AM
again, what judges are looking for. take a judging class and find out. ribs, take a bite and only the "mouth bite area " should be removed. not all of that side. I may or may not agree butt.... its the criteria...


do they take into consideration the sharpness of their teeth? You know sometimes veneers are sharper than implants, and forget dentures, they might pull of the gum before even tender ribs pull of the bone. :icon_devil

Sledneck
10-31-2008, 12:11 PM
again, what judges are looking for. take a judging class and find out. ribs, take a bite and only the "mouth bite area " should be removed. not all of that side. I may or may not agree butt.... its the criteria...Dont forget about the bone sweating

Dan - 3eyzbbq
10-31-2008, 07:06 PM
Not crazy about the presentation. Should be some green all around I think. They look pretty good though.