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BBQ_Mayor
06-29-2008, 08:18 PM
I'm wondering how i can do just a little better and would like all and any of the brethren's input.
These are from the contest this past weekend at Marshalltown. I'll post the scores after giving some time for input.

Chicken

17012

Ribs

17013

Pork

17014

Brisket

17015


Thanks for playing along.

Al
06-29-2008, 08:50 PM
I don't know what they look for in competitions, but my wife thinks that a couple of cherry tomatoes in between the chicken to add a little bit of variety.

BBQ_Mayor
06-29-2008, 08:57 PM
I don't know what they look for in competitions, but my wife thinks that a couple of cherry tomatoes in between the chicken to add a little bit of variety.

Can't do that. Only flat leaf parsley, curley parsley, or cliantro and grean leaf lettuce is aloud in the box. Besides the meat of coarse.

Plowboy
06-29-2008, 09:02 PM
The chicken looks all over the place in terms of shape and a little bland in color. However, I'm at a loss on what good chicken looks like these days. Probably a 6.

Ribs look great. I'd probably give them a 9. I personally don't like to show the bone end of the rib. I would have flipped that first row over.

Pork looks a bit dry. Probably still go 7.

The brisket looks buried. You can't really see it. I just see the top of some slices. Lay them out so I can see what the slices look like. I wouldn't give you any higher than a 6 on that.

Ron_L
06-29-2008, 09:10 PM
This is hard to do with pictures, first of all, plus when judging at a comp you don't have time to study the box looking for problems, so take this with a grain of salt...

Chicken - 7
The thighs aren't uniform in size. They do have nice color but the top two on the right appear to have more sauce than the others. The parsley is uneven around the perimeter and the pieces of parsley in between the thighs aren't the same size or shape. They either should be uniform or left off.

Ribs - 7
The ribs in the front row descending in size detracts from the box. If the back layer were the same size all the way across then put those in front. The garnish isn't bad but could be more even on the sides.

Pork - 6 or 7 (or a DQ)?
The meat looks good but it looks like the parsley base is showing through the pulled pork in areas. Fill that in and it would look much better. Here is where I have an issue and maybe an experienced rep or table captain can chime in. Ecen though you have enout meat in the box for 6 portions, if you include both slices and pulled do you have to have enough of both for each judge?

Brisket - 6 or 7 (or a DQ?)
Try to allow some of the brisket slice to show, not just the top of the slices. Also, the meat is getting lost in the garnish. Try to have the meat higher in the box so it shows above the garnish. My comment above about the pork slices also pertains gto the brisket chunks. I only see 5 chunks. Even if I am full of it on my interpretation on the amount of slices or chunks why not put in 6 (or more) just in case>

Plowboy
06-29-2008, 09:14 PM
Ron,

Those aren't DQ's. You don't have to have slices and chunks enough for each judge to have each. It is like having a whole chicken in a box but not having enough thighs and wings for each judge. They need a bite.

Ron_L
06-29-2008, 09:21 PM
Ron,

Those aren't DQ's. You don't have to have slices and chunks enough for each judge to have each. It is like having a whole chicken in a box but not having enough thighs and wings for each judge. They need a bite.

While I agree with that, Todd, here is what makes me wonder... In my judging class we were told that if a team turns in to forms of meat in a box (e.g., slices and pulled for pork, slices and chunks/burnt ends for brisket) we were to taste both and judge the entry based on both. If that is the case, and every judge doesn't get a piece of both, has that box been judged correctly by each judge?

Maybe I'll start a separate topic to discuss this so I don't hijack Ray's thread.

KC_Bobby
06-29-2008, 09:27 PM
Chicken - 7, various sizes and color looks a bit light, maybe set the glaze a bit thicker/longer

Ribs - 9, I want some, I want some now

Pork - 7, do I see one slice of the money muscle in the top center? Pop that meat up so the garnish doesn't hide it as much. BTW, that pork box layout looks familier :eusa_clap

Brisket - 6, where's the beef? slices are a bit thick and as a judge I'm assuming you put the brisket at a 90 vertical cause you are either trying to hide the lack of smoke ring, your dislike of the color or a dry appearance. And I'm judge #6, no burnt end for me :icon_pissed

Alexa RnQ
06-29-2008, 09:29 PM
I would agree that the chicken looks disorganized -- work on your pre-trimming to get more uniform pieces, then take care to select ones with a more matching appearance and have them oriented the same way in the box. The finish could be "roughed up" a bit more -- they look quite light, I'd like to see more color. They look a bit buried in the garnish.

The pork looks disorganized as well -- I find the parsley in the middle intensely distracting. You want your chunks to make a visual impact in the same way your slices do, not leave the eyeball skittering all around trying to make sense of it. Sunken in the garnish, it gives a skimpy impression.

The brisket slices need to be fanned back, so that the first slice is not obscured and the ring (if any) is displayed on all subsequent slices. Lose the parsley amongst the meat in front. Get that brisket up in the box, it looks like the greenery is trying to eat it.

I haven't got much to say about ribs because all I know is that I throw them in the box. http://www.divaherself.com/funny/shiner.gif

HoDeDo
06-29-2008, 09:35 PM
While I agree with that, Todd, here is what makes me wonder... In my judging class we were told that if a team turns in to forms of meat in a box (e.g., slices and pulled for pork, slices and chunks/burnt ends for brisket) we were to taste both and judge the entry based on both. If that is the case, and every judge doesn't get a piece of both, has that box been judged correctly by each judge?

Maybe I'll start a separate topic to discuss this so I don't hijack Ray's thread.

It is definitely in the competitors best interest to put at least 6 portions of each in the box.... however, I know several folks that put in portions of white and dark meat - for example.... so that if someone does not like dark, they have a white meat option... they dont try to fit 6 portions of each in the box. just 6 portions. Same with pork... some will put 4 big slices, and pile of pulled with 6 pieces of bark. So you get pulled or sliced, and bark.... Perfectly legal -- but do you want to get judged down if judge 5 and 6 had thier hearts set on thighs and have to take breast meat? Smart to have enough of all types for all judges.

BBQ_Mayor
06-29-2008, 09:36 PM
Just FYI - There are enough slices and burnt ends of pork and brisket respectively.

Ron_L
06-29-2008, 09:46 PM
Just FYI - There are enough slices and burnt ends of pork and brisket respectively.

That's why doing this from pictures is tough. I only count 5 pork slices on the left side of the box and 5 brisket chunks in the front of that box.

BTW, I didn't factor that into the scores that I gave above. It was an observation that started me thinking.

Rookie'48
06-30-2008, 12:30 AM
Ray, I pretty well agree with Todd (Plowboy) on his scores.

Chicky: 7 - uneven sizes & colors
Ribs: 8 or 9 - as Bobby said - "I want some - now"
Pork: 7 - it just looks kinda dis-organized / jumbled
Brisket: 6 - all I can see from the top is sauce.

ModelMaker
06-30-2008, 09:09 AM
Damn Andy, your one tough judge!!
Chicken - almost a 7, size is all over the place and sauce is uneven. Lose the cutsy sprigs of parsely in the middle, it's a distraction.
Ribs - Strong 8, Line that first row up more even and it's a 9. Look delicious!!
Pork - 7+ , loose the middle greenery and make the chunks on the right all one pile.
Brisket - 6, Show the whole slice in front. Get it a little higher in the box so we can see your good work. Those slices look really tasty.

It was really nice meeting up with all the Brethren teams we did miss finding a couple (Ray/Ulcer Acres and Greg/ Ribs 4 U).
Dave sorry I lied I was wearing a yellow shirt (forgot to pack the blue one mod)
Great showing by the Brethren teams.
Kids Q winner was none other than Caboose's boy!!!!!

Maybe we'll catch up in Waterloo.
ModelMaker (Ed)

Bigmista
06-30-2008, 11:56 AM
I'm posting before I read anyone else's comments.

Chicken: The middle piece on the left doesn't match the others in size. The sauce looks uneven on the top and middle pieces on the right. Lettuce is peeking out from under the parsley on the right side and nowhere else.

Ribs look great! I would turn them so that the bones face the front. I don't know if that affect the presentation for the judges. That's just a personal thing for me. Again, either have lettuce showing all around or tuck it all in. Having it show on one or two sides might hurt your presentation score (even though it shouldn't).

The Pork meat looks really good. Not sure what you were going for in the way of design.

The brisket looks very neat. I like the trimmed edges. If you are going to add burnt ends, add enough for every judge. I only count 5.

Those are my initial thoughts without reading any other posts. Hope it helps.

BBQ_Mayor
06-30-2008, 12:31 PM
The moment you've all been waiting for, the results.


Chicken 878989
RIBS 999979
PORK 878988
BRISKET 899888

scottyd
06-30-2008, 12:53 PM
The moment you've all been waiting for, the results.


Chicken 878989
RIBS 999979
PORK 878988
BRISKET 899888

Thats the scores I would have given. LOL

Captian fence rider!!!!

CivilWarBBQ
06-30-2008, 01:55 PM
Wow, you did really well, good for you! I don't know if you hit some lucky tables or if judges are more generous up there, but here in Georgia it would be very unusual to score that high with those boxes. I'd expect about a point lower across the board.

Not that you didn't put forth a good effort, those boxes just aren't quite in 9 territory IMO.

EDIT: Oops - forgot to add some constructive comments. I'd agree with most of what Ron L. said except for the DQ part. All those boxes are perfectly legal. One thing I'd suggest for sure is don't ever place garnish over the meat. It can't help you and it will make judges wonder what you are trying to hide. If you need to mask an imperfection, do so with positioning or another piece of meat, but not parsley. That's my $.02 anyway.

smoke showin'
06-30-2008, 02:23 PM
put some grill marks on the chiken , angle the brisket back from smaller to larger to better show the smoke ring , put some pulled under your bark if you are going to do it like that it will help keep it warm too.

Sawdustguy
06-30-2008, 06:36 PM
Wow, you did really well, good for you! I don't know if you hit some lucky tables or if judges are more generous up there, but here in Georgia it would be very unusual to score that high with those boxes. I'd expect about a point lower across the board.

Not that you didn't put forth a good effort, those boxes just aren't quite in 9 territory IMO.

EDIT: Oops - forgot to add some constructive comments. I'd agree with most of what Ron L. said except for the DQ part. All those boxes are perfectly legal. One thing I'd suggest for sure is don't ever place garnish over the meat. It can't help you and it will make judges wonder what you are trying to hide. If you need to mask an imperfection, do so with positioning or another piece of meat, but not parsley. That's my $.02 anyway.

I was thinking the same thing. I don't think they would score that highly up here in the Northeast either but what the hey what do I know?

Solidkick
06-30-2008, 07:04 PM
The moment you've all been waiting for, the results.


Chicken 878989 You got a good table, :cool:
RIBS 999979 Don't know where the 7 came from, probably threw it out anyway
PORK 878988 I think is fair
BRISKET 899888 Another good table, if the taste and tenderness was there, top 15


The chicken box, a 7 for me.....but hey, I wasn't at your table!