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View Full Version : Another KCBS/MMA Debacle


pigmaker23
03-30-2008, 09:33 AM
Well Folks, it appears that MMA has once again fallen way short in it's attempt to "market" the KCBS and Barbeque across the USA. Apparently they have purchased and tried to outfit a truck and trailer that is supposed to make apperances at competitions across the country.

Guess what, it does not not have a smoker installed it! it has stove/grill with no hood, no surpression system, no hot boxes or sanitary set up. it basically can grill hamburgers and hot dogs what it apparently was doing in New Mexico this weekend. From what I have been told it comes nowhere near being NSA or Health Department approvalable!

The best part, they bought a used pickup truck to pull this rig that is grossly underpowered and according to the people that transported it to New Mexico on a volunteer basis did not handle well at all.

The time has come for the membership to stand up and speak out with regard to the poor job MMA is doing for the membership, I have agreed with people's opinion in the past to take a wait and see attitude with regard to this contract, however it becomes more and more apparent that MMA does not not have the level of skill required to represent the KCBS in any manner.

If anybody was at the contest in New Mexico and has pictures please post them. I find it hard to believe that MMA could not find a truck maker, smoker company and trailer manufactuer that would either donate or greatly reduce the cost of these items so that a world class rig could be presented. Please everyone feel free to chime in with your opinion...

bbqbull
03-30-2008, 02:04 PM
So..........are we going to do a petition and sign as a group or do the individual letters to the BOD?
Another fine example of taxation without representation......Any thoughts?

Ford
03-30-2008, 02:22 PM
So..........are we going to do a petition and sign as a group or do the individual letters to the BOD?
Another fine example of taxation without representation......Any thoughts?
From some things I'm reading on another Forum they are now aware of the problems with the trailer and vehicle. Mike McCleod has indicated that changes will be made to the trailer for the health code issues.

I expect that our "ambassadors" will put pressure on the BOD about the truck. And it will work much better in the flatlands of Kansas or Michigan for that matter. All of us with gas guzzlers know the challenges of elevations above 5000 feet when towing.

As for not having a smoker - well here's my thought. If a contest has vendors selling BBQ then the KCBS trailer can't give away BBQ. But they can give away other food that can be cooked using one of the key sponsors products. So while I would like to have a smoker on it I'd be cooking non traditional BBQ stuff.

If you really want to write the BOD about something how about - who/whom is responsible for the trailer and what it does? Is it MMA or KCBS BOD or some combination of both?

ThomEmery
03-30-2008, 02:24 PM
Those that have spoken to MMA were promised corrections
Next question why would it be sent as it was?

BBQchef33
03-30-2008, 05:49 PM
I know little about the KCBS Roadshow..only what was said at the banquet. But I understood it as a platform to bring BBQ to the public and bring people into Competitive BBQ. Mccloud compared it to the Nascar trailers. But without having a smoker on board, its like having a Nascar trailer and showing off mini-bike engines. Maybe for all intents and purposes a grill and cambro are enough.. but I'l like to know what the intent and purpose of the roadshow really is. If this is truly the flagship of KCBS, i would think it should show and real interpertation of what we do. Im not saying serve up 300 briskets, but along withthe grilling samples, at least give an accurate rendition and not make people think a steak and burger is BBQ.

Roo-B-Q'N
03-30-2008, 06:00 PM
From the blurb on the KCBS Website:

" The Kansas City Barbeque Society is proud to announce the upcoming launch of The Great American BBQ Tour, a cross-country tour of some of the nation's top BBQ and food festivals.

This tour, which will be on display at 23 premiere events and also make numerous stops at retail locations across the U.S., will show how backyard barbecuers can take tips from the BBQ pros of the KCBS and apply them to their outdoor cooking at home.

The tour will also demonstrate the products that go great in and with world-class BBQ, including TABASCO brand Chipotle Pepper Sauce, Weber Grill Creations, Royal Oak charcoal and Chinet tableware.

Stop by the Great American BBQ Tour display, and you will not only learn tips from the pros, but you can sample BBQ from our expert chefs and walk away with great recipes and tips to use at home.

If you have ever wanted to take your barbecuing to the next level, then be sure to check out the Great American BBQ Tour - coming to a city near you! Keep checking back for an updated schedule of tour events."




I remember sitting at the banquet and Mike McLoud saying how much time he spent getting to know BBQing and what it is all about (I can't remember the exact number of contests he said he went to but I think it was around 3). I think they are missing the bus and need to revamp quickly or they are doing KCBS a dis-service and misleading the public.

Yes we can all season our meats with Tobasco Chipotle, while cooking it on the Weber grill over Royal oak charcoal and serving it on Chinet but none of this really speaks to what BBQing is all about and what it takes. It is not hamburgers and hot dogs.

I heard somewhere where they had hoped competitors would step up and cook food for them to hand out. I can't imagine that happening anywhere.

motoeric
03-30-2008, 06:01 PM
I'm not trying to pimp my site (as a matter of fact, if people are interested I'll cut and paste the relevant parts here), but Mike McCloud is supposed to have the interview questions back to me by Monday or Tuesday and one of the topics covered is the tour.

As soon as I get them back I'll shoot off some follow-ups with specific issues regarding the rig.

Eric

MilitantSquatter
03-30-2008, 06:10 PM
I still don't get the full purpose of how the demo introduces BBQ to the uninitiated. Aren't these people somewhat initiated by there presence at the actual event seeing what's going on with all the teams ?

Seems pretty dumb to be grilling flank steaks and chicken wings and saying this is what KCBS is when surrounding the trailer could be 20-100+ teams at the same event cooking brisket, butts, ribs & chicken on smokers.

Wonder what the conversations are gonna be like

"Hey honey... That hot dog and london broil they gave us to sample in that BBQ trailer was awesome !!!... I think I'm gonna go compete now.."

Attract future judges ? Maybe... Attract future teams ? Not many...

watertowerbbq
03-30-2008, 09:58 PM
Maybe they could hand out DVD's from the Food Network when they've done an episode about BBQ. I've learned a lot from watching those programs and picked up some pointer's along the way. That would be promoting BBQ!

Do my hotdogs have to be plain or can they have ketchup and mustard on them in the turn-in box? :eek:

BBQchef33
03-30-2008, 10:43 PM
From the blurb on the KCBS Website:

" The Kansas City Barbeque Society is proud to announce the upcoming launch of The Great American BBQ Tour, a cross-country tour of some of the nation's top BBQ and food festivals.

This tour, which will be on display at 23 premiere events and also make numerous stops at retail locations across the U.S., will show how backyard barbecuers can take tips from the BBQ pros of the KCBS and apply them to their outdoor cooking at home.

The tour will also demonstrate the products that go great in and with world-class BBQ, including TABASCO brand Chipotle Pepper Sauce, Weber Grill Creations, Royal Oak charcoal and Chinet tableware.

Stop by the Great American BBQ Tour display, and you will not only learn tips from the pros, but you can sample BBQ from our expert chefs and walk away with great recipes and tips to use at home.

If you have ever wanted to take your barbecuing to the next level, then be sure to check out the Great American BBQ Tour - coming to a city near you! Keep checking back for an updated schedule of tour events."




See the red print up there? Who are the experts? How is visiting a trailer thats handing our burgers and steaks taking 'barbecuing to the next level'.

We are probably all jumping the gun without seeing the demo first hand, but based on the descriptions offered, i think a newcomer, just attending a competition and talking up the teams will get a better feel for BBQ than what they will get form the roadshow.

I was also under the impression that there were a few teams,KCBS insiders, or 'experts' associated with the roadshow besides the 2 regulars. Anyone know of that stuff?

Love to see how this pans out.

BBQ Grail
03-30-2008, 10:50 PM
We should be thankful!

They could be boiling ribs.

jminion
03-30-2008, 11:03 PM
What does a marketing firm know about putting a trailer together? The chairman of the Marketing Committee had a lot of input on what trailer was going to bought, I would have thought there would have been more input since he has trailer of his own. But then maybe he did.

ThomEmery
03-31-2008, 09:34 AM
Maybe we can get Gene to report on what he saw and heard
MMA says they will correct this
Arlie Did you go to NM?

StLouQue
03-31-2008, 10:46 AM
While I agree grill demonstrations could compound the misunderstanding of what barbecue entails; just how would an onboard smoker educate and inform?

Grilling takes minutes, not hours like barbecue. Someone please explain to me what knowledge short attention span audiences would gain from gazing at a closed smoker continuously emitting "true blue?"

Consider this: When beginning your own transition from grilling to barbecue, how many of us made our first attempts with wood chips in a foil pan of water, coals to the side, in a Weber kettle? I suspect most people curious enough to attend a demonstration would be encouraged to learn that they can experiment with the equipment they already own and are familiar with.

Regardless, I'll reserve my judgement until I know all the facts and until the Roadshow has had sufficient time to work out the bugs. I doubt anyone has ever done something new perfectly the first time. So, maybe lighten up.

Sledneck
03-31-2008, 10:49 AM
While I agree grill demonstrations could compound the misunderstanding of what barbecue entails; just how would an onboard smoker educate and inform?

Grilling takes minutes, not hours like barbecue. Someone please explain to me what knowledge short attention span audiences would gain from gazing at a closed smoker continuously emitting "true blue?"

Consider this: When beginning your own transition from grilling to barbecue, how many of us made our first attempts with wood chips in a foil pan of water, coals to the side, in a Weber kettle? I suspect most people curious enough to attend a demonstration would be encouraged to learn that they can experiment with the equipment they already own and are familiar with.

Regardless, I'll reserve my judgement until I know all the facts and until the Roadshow has had sufficient time to work out the bugs. I doubt anyone has ever done something new perfectly the first time. So, maybe lighten up.
Amen, everybody is so quick to judge. What they really need is a van and a couple of kettles and even a gas grill to get folks started on the right track. That is how i introduce new people to it

Spydermike72
03-31-2008, 11:30 AM
While I agree grill demonstrations could compound the misunderstanding of what barbecue entails; just how would an onboard smoker educate and inform?

Grilling takes minutes, not hours like barbecue. Someone please explain to me what knowledge short attention span audiences would gain from gazing at a closed smoker continuously emitting "true blue?"

Consider this: When beginning your own transition from grilling to barbecue, how many of us made our first attempts with wood chips in a foil pan of water, coals to the side, in a Weber kettle? I suspect most people curious enough to attend a demonstration would be encouraged to learn that they can experiment with the equipment they already own and are familiar with.

Regardless, I'll reserve my judgement until I know all the facts and until the Roadshow has had sufficient time to work out the bugs. I doubt anyone has ever done something new perfectly the first time. So, maybe lighten up.

Good Points Steve, but... what is the biggest draw at a BBQ Comp ?? The Cookers. Joe Schmoo sees a big ole Klose or a Lang and they start to drool, not thinking that they dont know how to use the thing.

I think the KCBS could have a smoker running with the smoke rolling and have already completed pieces of the 4 categories and briefly describe the different ways to cook the cuts and show them a before and after in real time. Now of course doing this over a 2 day period presents its own challenges. At least it is not sliders and rollers....

DawgPhan
03-31-2008, 12:45 PM
Yeah I think that you could demo all of the BBQ that you would want to if you planned it that way.

Same thing with a cooking show or something...They can show you all the steps in 30 minutes even if the cooking takes longer...

I say give them the benefit of the doubt..this is the first of many trips and I am sure that it was all a learning experience.

StLouQue
03-31-2008, 01:00 PM
Good Points Steve, but... what is the biggest draw at a BBQ Comp ?? The Cookers. Joe Schmoo sees a big ole Klose or a Lang and they start to drool, not thinking that they dont know how to use the thing.

I think the KCBS could have a smoker running with the smoke rolling and have already completed pieces of the 4 categories and briefly describe the different ways to cook the cuts and show them a before and after in real time. Now of course doing this over a 2 day period presents its own challenges. At least it is not sliders and rollers....

Mike,

Your idea in the second paragraph looks like a great idea. I'm not sure I agree with the first point, however. What is the intended function of the Roadshow? To promote equipment to the already converted? Or to introduce real barbecue to the uninitiated, thereby potentially expanding the KCBS membership? Maybe you and I hang with a different crowd, but not many of the backyard "princes of propane" that I know are going to make a substantial investment in a piece of equipment without first seeing if they even enjoy cooking "low and slow."

Besides, I haven't heard any evidence that Dave Klose accepts drool as legal tender.:wink:

G$
03-31-2008, 01:24 PM
<shakes head> and again thinks about creating a(nother) grass roots sanctioning body.

BBQchef33
03-31-2008, 01:30 PM
I have been holding off hitting submit for a few hours....or was just backing out on an already finished post... i don't want anyone thinking I'm trying to spin this down a negative route.. so take it with a grain of salt and one mans opinion..

As I said, we shouldn't jump the gun until someone here has first hand knowledge, but here is my issue, and my 2 cents worth. This is not a bitch session, but my observations based on the little knowledge I have. Also, keep in mind, this is the firts time out.. i am sure they had a lot of lessons learned from it, and the next will be better. But just to add my take on the debate.

My basis:
This tour will show how backyard barbecuers can take tips from the BBQ pros of the KCBS and apply them to their outdoor cooking at home.

The tour will also demonstrate the products that go great in and with world-class BBQ, including TABASCO brand Chipotle Pepper Sauce, Weber Grill Creations, Royal Oak charcoal and Chinet tableware.

Stop by the Great American BBQ Tour display, and you will not only learn tips from the pros, but you can sample BBQ from our expert chefs and walk away with great recipes and tips to use at home.

If you have ever wanted to take your barbecuing to the next level, then be sure to check out the Great American BBQ Tour - coming to a city near you! Keep checking back for an updated schedule of tour events."It seems they want to educate the public on BBQ. But how can they do that with a stove, a grill and a cambro.?

isn't this trailer built for demonstrations?

Shouldn't one wall of this trailer have cookers? An offset, a vertical, A bullet and a pellet feeder.?? Shouldn't it have 'exhibits' on it? Shouldn't it have something that someone can go in and learn something from? Maybe it chould even be set up as a competition rig? I know when the public peeks into a competiton setup trailer, or wanders around a cook site, they can see what its all about.

i am not saying that the setups in the trailer should be belching smoke, but they can be static exhibits.. Wouldn't having a few smokers be more advantageous to educating the public than Chinette? or Tobasco?

We(some local teams) did a demonstration last summer.. for 200 people. As the organzier of this demo, I was comically abused for putting on something that was touthed as .. "Let us show the public what BBQ is all about." It was to be a showcase of The Brethren Teams and competition BBQ". Similar to the 'roadshow'

But we set up 4-5 stations. Each showing off a different aspect of BBQ.. A Lang trailer rig, a WSM station, A bandera station, A BIG vertical offset(Moab) and a kettle/grilling station. Each station was cooking something.. My trailer was there for people to look in and see the extent we go to to compete. We talked about woods, cooking times, judging, competing over all. And this was done while the pits were belching smoke and loaded with ribs, brisket, butts and chicken.. Butts were taken out and pulled in front of the crowd, briskets sliced, ribs piled high.. etc... and YES..we had grills going also with beer can chickens and even burgers... All done in 3-4 hours. (butts and briskets were cooked offsite and finsihed in the pits)

We explained how this can be done on the cheapest of grills, to gassers all the way up to the offsets and pellet feeders. That was our demo.. When people left, they had a feel for Real BBQ, and a taste of it too. This was done on a shoestring budget, by volunteers using their own equipment.

I would think, that the KCBS roadshow, as the premiere organization and with such a large investment, they would do it right from the onset. Is this about education people about BBQ, or is this more about showing off tobasco, Royal oak and chinette? I hope to see this thing work out for the best, but from what I have been reading, in various places, it seems to have started out somewhat weak. Lets see what the future holds with the first wave of 'corrections'. IMHO, if we can do it in an office parking lot with limited resources, KCBS can do it 10 times better.

Roo-B-Q'N
03-31-2008, 02:41 PM
AMEN!

We had a tasting for a bride and groom that we are goingto be catering for this fall at the house this weekend. We did ribs, butt, brisket, salmon the whole works and we made sure we pulled the butt in front of them and sliced the brisket in front of them cut the ribs ect all in front of them and they had questions from what type of wood to how to get started.
We answered all of the questions and showed them one of our 5 smokers and how it worked. Groom asked if I thought he could get started using an electric smoker (my wife jokingly said hell no) but I told him sure and asked what was his reasoning. He said he didn't feel he had 12+ hours to dedicate to making a brisket ove charcoal and wood. I told him it didn't matter what he was going to use that low and slow was exactly that low and slow. He was going to have to take the time weather it was on a huge cooker, and electric or a webber with chips and a water pan.
To me that is educating the public and I don't mean to pat my own back here, but I see this type of education going on at comps all the time.
They would be better off asking the comp organizer to find a team that they could pay to cook up some stuff for handouts and showing the public that it could be done on a charcoal grill with woodchips like mentioned above. But hamburgers and hotdogs are not the way to go.

Bigdog
03-31-2008, 03:51 PM
I too am embarrassed, but not surprised, by what sounds like a pitiful demonstration of BBQ. I haven't been impressed so far by the MMA so I am not shocked by this. It sounded like a good idea, but it seems to be poorly organized and implemented. This is the fault of both the MMA and the board. In order for something like this to be successful, you need someone heading it up that knows what the fark they are talking about (see Phil's thread above-he is dead on correct). What a shame this is not being done well. Shame on you KCBS and MMA.

Stoke&Smoke
03-31-2008, 06:17 PM
From KCBS's website http://kcbs.us/tour.php

"Stop by the Great American BBQ Tour display, and you will not only learn tips from the pros, but you can sample BBQ from our expert chefs and walk away with great recipes and tips to use at home"

Really? Barbecue? Cooked on a gas griill?!?!? I like steaks brats and hot dogs as much as the next person, but are they Barbecue?

Spydermike72
04-01-2008, 10:20 AM
Mike,

Your idea in the second paragraph looks like a great idea. I'm not sure I agree with the first point, however. What is the intended function of the Roadshow? To promote equipment to the already converted? Or to introduce real barbecue to the uninitiated, thereby potentially expanding the KCBS membership? Maybe you and I hang with a different crowd, but not many of the backyard "princes of propane" that I know are going to make a substantial investment in a piece of equipment without first seeing if they even enjoy cooking "low and slow."

Besides, I haven't heard any evidence that Dave Klose accepts drool as legal tender.:wink:

Hey Steve,

I agree with your point, but the Klose and the Lang are big attention getters, that is what I meant. I like your "princes of propane" term that is funny!!

Dale P
04-01-2008, 10:46 AM
We need a mascot. Burnie the bbqer.

Sledneck
04-01-2008, 10:48 AM
From the KCBS website :
The First Tour Stop - Poland Notes

March 31, 2008

Well, our visit to Rio Rancho is complete, and we have learned a lot about what this tour is going to take: lots of hard work. We are both sleeping very well!

We had three beautiful sunny days here, with strong winds on two of the days. At an altitude of 5,000 plus feet, the sun is strong so we both used lots of sun screen, but we'll still get home with nice starts on tans on our arms and faces. This area is also VERY windy. Two of the three days here had winds at 20-30 MPH with gusts above that. We had lots of challenges keeping our coupons and information brochures on our tables rather than being blown to who knows where.

Unexpectedly, it also proved a challenge to grill on our very nice grill because the winds basically blew the heat away. But thanks to determination and lots of help, the job got done.

Ernie got his first round of applause for his grilling demonstration at his Saturday afternoon session!

Equipment in our trailer worked well. We passed inspections from the local fire marshal, a state propane inspector, and two local county food inspectors. We got a few suggestions on things to change in the trailer, so we'll be taking it back to Tennessee for a few tweaks between tour stops.

Members of 20-25 of the 60 cook teams competing here came and saw us and toured our new trailer with mostly very positive comments. As always, one of our favorite parts of being around competitive BBQ is interacting with the teams. It is just something we enjoy a great deal and a big part of why we are on this tour.

We now have a much better handle on the amount of meats we need to prepare for our sampling sessions. Believe it or not, we gave out more than 1,000 samples of food during the entire weekend! And everyone was very appreciative to KCBS for the experience....which gave us lots of encouragement and energy.

The real purpose of our tour is to build knowledge about the Kansas City BBQ Society rather than to teach people about competitive BBQ. In Ernie’s demonstrations he tells people they can be better backyard grillers by taking a few tips from the professional BBQ cooks. He also encourages everyone to visit the KCBS web site, where they can even join the society, look for more contests to attend, or even become a certified judge. (It doesn’t pay, but you get to taste lots of good BBQ, and meet lots of great people!)

We start driving back to Tennessee Sunday morning and will get back on Tuesday afternoon. One advantage of all the uphill driving we did coming out here is that we should have lots of downhill on the way home.

Dozens of people are honking and waving at us on the road. If you're a KCBS member, honk three times so we know you area true fan!!!

Ernie and Linda

Divemaster
04-01-2008, 11:06 AM
Interesting... Quite a different story...

Neal
04-01-2008, 11:08 AM
Like others have said...I will reserve judgement until I see this thing for myself. Also keep in mind that this was the first time out. Did any one go out and win a GC at their first contest? Give them a month or two to make adjustments.

That said, I did hear a few stories about the vehicle pulling this trailer. Some people were really piling on that too - which to me seemed a little petty. But, given the story I heard about the vehicle being under-powered to pull the rig, I thought this was a clever spin written in the report of the first stop in Rio Rancho...

From the KCBS website :
Dozens of people are honking and waving at us on the road. If you're a KCBS member, honk three times so we know you area true fan!!!


They may have been honking and waving...but from what I heard, they honking and waving telling them to move over so they could be passed!

These guys are learning as they go. I wish them luck.

StLouQue
04-01-2008, 12:16 PM
From the KCBS website :
The First Tour Stop - Poland Notes

March 31, 2008

The real purpose of our tour is to build knowledge about the Kansas City BBQ Society rather than to teach people about competitive BBQ.

Thank you for posting the clarification, Sled.


Hey Steve,

I agree with your point, but the Klose and the Lang are big attention getters, that is what I meant. I like your "princes of propane" term that is funny!!

I was with you, Mike. All I really hoped to do with my posts was suggest a few folks (not you necessarily) set aside the torches and pitchforks, step back, and take an unbiased look at what KCBS is trying to achieve with this demo rig.

Some seem to believe that MMA has no business promoting the KCBS. Obviously, the KCBS thinks otherwise.

Perhaps I should state I have a bittersweet opinion of consultants. From 1987-91, I was a radio dj at small market Missouri station. The station's owner thought it was in his best interests to hire a programming consultant from Florida. My air talent colleagues and I balked at the idea of someone who didn't know our market, coming in and changing the sound of "our" station.

In the next Arbitron ratings book, however, we claimed the number 2 spot in total listenership, and I was pulling in 98% of the 18-35 year olds demo. Why? Because the consultant gave our listeners what was popular, instead of what we music snobs deemed "quality" music. The sheep loved their hits. While I still bristled at having to submit to the cookie-cutter ideas of an out-of-towner, I had no trouble accepting my bonus check, and pay increase.

There are a lot of differing opinions on the best way to do something. Disagreement with the KCBS/MMA decisions was a given, regardless the direction they went. Last I checked, it was still an imperfect world.

Roo-B-Q'N
04-01-2008, 04:26 PM
From the KCBS website :
The First Tour Stop - Poland Notes

March 31, 2008

Well, our visit to Rio Rancho is complete, and we have learned a lot about what this tour is going to take: lots of hard work. We are both sleeping very well!

We had three beautiful sunny days here, with strong winds on two of the days. At an altitude of 5,000 plus feet, the sun is strong so we both used lots of sun screen, but we'll still get home with nice starts on tans on our arms and faces. This area is also VERY windy. Two of the three days here had winds at 20-30 MPH with gusts above that. We had lots of challenges keeping our coupons and information brochures on our tables rather than being blown to who knows where.

Unexpectedly, it also proved a challenge to grill on our very nice grill because the winds basically blew the heat away. But thanks to determination and lots of help, the job got done.

Ernie got his first round of applause for his grilling demonstration at his Saturday afternoon session!

Equipment in our trailer worked well. We passed inspections from the local fire marshal, a state propane inspector, and two local county food inspectors. We got a few suggestions on things to change in the trailer, so we'll be taking it back to Tennessee for a few tweaks between tour stops.

Members of 20-25 of the 60 cook teams competing here came and saw us and toured our new trailer with mostly very positive comments. As always, one of our favorite parts of being around competitive BBQ is interacting with the teams. It is just something we enjoy a great deal and a big part of why we are on this tour.

We now have a much better handle on the amount of meats we need to prepare for our sampling sessions. Believe it or not, we gave out more than 1,000 samples of food during the entire weekend! And everyone was very appreciative to KCBS for the experience....which gave us lots of encouragement and energy.

The real purpose of our tour is to build knowledge about the Kansas City BBQ Society rather than to teach people about competitive BBQ. In Ernie’s demonstrations he tells people they can be better backyard grillers by taking a few tips from the professional BBQ cooks. He also encourages everyone to visit the KCBS web site, where they can even join the society, look for more contests to attend, or even become a certified judge. (It doesn’t pay, but you get to taste lots of good BBQ, and meet lots of great people!)

We start driving back to Tennessee Sunday morning and will get back on Tuesday afternoon. One advantage of all the uphill driving we did coming out here is that we should have lots of downhill on the way home.

Dozens of people are honking and waving at us on the road. If you're a KCBS member, honk three times so we know you area true fan!!!

Ernie and Linda


Maybe I am just one of those that needs to put down their pitchfork and torch, but this just rubbed me the wrong way. I guess I just don't understand how they are explaining that backyard grillers can pick up tips and tricks from competitive BBQ'rs. Is it in seasoning, saucing, glazing? Perhaps the script that MMA came up with for this could be provided so those of us not attending any of these anytime soon can see how they are doing this.

Yah it was a nice little article and all but I think they are missing the boat. I am going to step back and see how this all pans out.

pigmaker23
04-01-2008, 06:22 PM
This press release is just damage control from MMA. They are aware of the complaints as noted on The BBQ Forum and here and are starting the spin already.

This set up is not what should be representative of what the KCBS image should be. The entire point of this thread is to bring to light the shortfalls, repair or replace them and move on, promoting American BBQ.

The question remains, who at KCBS approved this setup, the tour presentation outline, tour schedule etc. Anyone know who was responsible ? We as members have an amazing amount of talent among us, what is now being paraded around the country does not reflect our talents or capabilities. I guess I will see for myself in Indio in few weeks at the Stagecoach..

Maybe I am just one of those that needs to put down their pitchfork and torch, but this just rubbed me the wrong way. I guess I just don't understand how they are explaining that backyard grillers can pick up tips and tricks from competitive BBQ'rs. Is it in seasoning, saucing, glazing? Perhaps the script that MMA came up with for this could be provided so those of us not attending any of these anytime soon can see how they are doing this.

Yah it was a nice little article and all but I think they are missing the boat. I am going to step back and see how this all pans out.

scottyd
04-01-2008, 07:08 PM
I just boiled some ribs. and fried some brisket trimmings on my george forman. hmmmmmmmmmm

Bigdog
04-01-2008, 07:17 PM
Does anyone know who Ernie and Linda are and what their qualifications are?

BBQ Grail
04-01-2008, 07:21 PM
Does anyone know who Ernie and Linda are and what their qualifications are?

They can drive a truck!

Bigdog
04-01-2008, 07:25 PM
They can drive a truck!

LOL Larry.:lol: And an underpowered one to boot. Just says to me that this thing was poorly conceived from the get go.:roll:

Sledneck
04-01-2008, 07:32 PM
What does the truck have to do with it? If it able to pull it what is wrong with it? Do you expect them to purchase a fully loaded dually?

Sledneck
04-01-2008, 07:34 PM
I am more embarrassed of the way you guys are publicly complaining about something that not one person here has seen or even has a picture of!!!!!

BBQ Grail
04-01-2008, 07:35 PM
What does the truck have to do with it? If it able to pull it what is wrong with it? Do you expect them to purchase a fully loaded dually?

Purchase? Why purchase? How about actually getting out and working with GM or Ford and let them loan you a truck AND share in advertising costs. Co-Sponsorship would have been the say to go.

Maybe the KCBS could hire a marketing firm to consult with the marketing firm they hired on just how to actually pull something like this off.

Sledneck
04-01-2008, 07:37 PM
Purchase? Why purchase? How about actually getting out and working with GM or Ford and let them loan you a truck AND share in advertising costs. Co-Sponsorship would have been the say to go.

Maybe the KCBS could hire a marketing firm to consult with the marketing firm they hired on just how to actually pull something like this off.Hmmmm a BBQ sanctioning body must be real high on the list over in detroit

BBQchef33
04-01-2008, 07:41 PM
Does anyone know who Ernie and Linda are and what their qualifications are?



Dont shoot the messengers. Erinie and Linda are doing are doing what they can with what they have. Seems they have some experience and maybe they can work the changes. They are hired drivers/instructors.. they didnt build or design the trailer.

What I think is more important is that THEY know what the charter and goals of this tour is, whereas WE dont and are speculating. I'd still like to see the 30 day changes MMA agreed to and see if they get the train on a different/right track, or change the destination.. meaning STOP touting it as a KCBS roadshow bringing BBQ to a new level, but make it a promotional tour for the sponsors, Royal oak, Chinette, weber, etc..




time ladies.. give it time..
KCBS Tour Team Announced

March 7, 2008

http://www.kcbs.us/images/ErnieLinda.jpg KCBS announced today that Ernie and Linda Poland, proud KCBS members and active volunteers for the society, have been selected as the demonstration team for The Great American BBQ Tour.

The tour, which kicks off March 28 at the Pork ‘n Brew BBQ Cookoff in Rio Rancho, NM, will feature demonstrations of bbq tips and techniques for backyard bbq’ers, as well as introduce KCBS’s national partners and conduct live interviews of KCBS teams at events across the country.

The Polands, who have been members since 2003, are no strangers to barbeque. In fact, they are certified judges (Ernie is a Master Judge!) and table captains who were also approved as Contest Reps after their training program in 2007. They were scheduled to work as Reps at three events this year before accepting the tour’s opportunity as KCBS ambassadors.

“We are thrilled about this opportunity to represent KCBS in a new and exciting way,” commented Ernie, who has a lot of food training and experience from his previous career as an Army Officer and more recently as the Director of Residence Halls and the associated food services at Purdue University. Linda and Ernie are both Purdue graduates. “As an ambassador for KCBS, we will take this job very seriously, and we hope to not only teach, but to learn a lot along the way from the great cooks and teams who represent our society.”

Prior to being selected as the Tour Team, the Polands were enjoying a brief retirement that allowed them to travel to and work at 18 KCBS events in 2007. They now reside in Fairfield Glade, Tenn, where they have lived for two years since leaving Indiana.

For the past few weeks, the Polands have been training for the tour by working with MMA Creative and the national sponsors of the tour. The sponsors include Tabasco brand Chipotle Pepper Sauce, Weber Grill Creations, Chinet tableware and Royal Oak Charcoal, the official charcoal of KCBS.

Along with their official demo speech, they will be providing tasty samples of chicken, steak and hamburgers at 24 of the nation’s biggest bbq events and festivals, as well as 25 retail stops along the way. To help with the samplings, they are hoping to get other KCBS members at each event to assist with food prep and serving.

“We definitely hope to get some help from our many friends and other KCBS fans along the way,” commented Linda, who encouraged possible volunteers to email her at lspoland@frontiernet.net.

The Polands will be hauling a 31-foot trailer to all events that should become a focal point for telling the KCBS story and improving the knowledge of contest attendees about the world of competition bbq. Both Ernie and Linda hope that teams will take time to come to the trailer and interact with the folks visiting the contest or festival. By the end of October, the KCBS truck and trailer should have traveled about 23,000 miles.

To learn more about The Great American BBQ Tour and where it will be making tour stops, check the Tour schedule at http://www.kcbs.us/tour.php.

BBQ Grail
04-01-2008, 07:42 PM
Hmmmm a BBQ sanctioning body must be real high on the list over in detroit

Isn't about Detroit. It's about the number of people of you are going to meet and greet along with the demographic. I think you'll find the BBQ group fits quite nicely into the demographic Detroit is looking for.

And loaning a truck to the KCBS doesn't cost "detroit" anything...

Bigdog
04-01-2008, 07:44 PM
What does the truck have to do with it? If it able to pull it what is wrong with it? Do you expect them to purchase a fully loaded dually?

Several things:

1) A truck that is under powered may be dangerous.
2) This truck, if purchased by KCBS or MMA that is inappropriate for the load may incur damage therefore costing more money in the long run.
3) And if this truck is inappropriate for the load, it just shows that this whole thing was poorly planned and coordinated.

No, I am not saying that they should purchase a fully loaded dually!:roll:

Next question.

BBQchef33
04-01-2008, 08:29 PM
FYI.... this just in..

i asked a question.... what is KCBS' anticipated return on investment of this venture. ???

The answer.
The entire project is funded by the sponsors. KCBS has not invested $$ in it.
ok.. good, so we(members) are not footing the bill.


So next question..

Does KCBS consider their name and reputation an investment in this venture?

Thats still open.

Bigdog
04-01-2008, 09:05 PM
FYI.... this just in..

i asked a question.... what is KCBS' anticipated return on investment of this venture.

The answer.
The entire project is funded by the sponsors. KCBS has not invested $$ in it.

So next question..

Does KCBS consider their name and reputation an investment in this venture?

Thats still open.



Good, in a way. The problem may be that since it is not their money, they may not be in control. Note: This is speculation.

I must have missed this, but when did the KCBS change its name to the KCGS meaning the Kansas City Grilling Society? I thought that they were about BBQ? Guess not.:roll: Note: This is not speculation, but fact. We try very hard on this forum to separate and understand the difference between the two. Why are they doing this. I believe the answer is my first point, the one that is speculation.


My final point here is that I am not impressed with the qualifications of the demonstrators. He was a Army and Food Service guy. Neither of which have that much to do with BBQ or memorable food. Certainly qualified as a cook, but no mention of BBQ or contests. Yes, I see that he is a master judge, so he does know what good BBQ is, but does he know how to do it. Maybe so but not a given.

Spydermike72
04-02-2008, 11:21 AM
FYI.... this just in..

So next question..

Does KCBS consider their name and reputation an investment in this venture?

Thats still open.

That is the $64,000 question right there. I would be interested in seeing the answer to that one.

Phil, thanks for asking the "tough" questions!!

Spydermike72
04-02-2008, 11:23 AM
Thank you for posting the clarification, Sled.




I was with you, Mike. All I really hoped to do with my posts was suggest a few folks (not you necessarily) set aside the torches and pitchforks, step back, and take an unbiased look at what KCBS is trying to achieve with this demo rig.

Some seem to believe that MMA has no business promoting the KCBS. Obviously, the KCBS thinks otherwise.

Perhaps I should state I have a bittersweet opinion of consultants. From 1987-91, I was a radio dj at small market Missouri station. The station's owner thought it was in his best interests to hire a programming consultant from Florida. My air talent colleagues and I balked at the idea of someone who didn't know our market, coming in and changing the sound of "our" station.

In the next Arbitron ratings book, however, we claimed the number 2 spot in total listenership, and I was pulling in 98% of the 18-35 year olds demo. Why? Because the consultant gave our listeners what was popular, instead of what we music snobs deemed "quality" music. The sheep loved their hits. While I still bristled at having to submit to the cookie-cutter ideas of an out-of-towner, I had no trouble accepting my bonus check, and pay increase.

There are a lot of differing opinions on the best way to do something. Disagreement with the KCBS/MMA decisions was a given, regardless the direction they went. Last I checked, it was still an imperfect world.


Steve, I agree with you, let's give them a chance to make some changes and let's see how it turns out. If there is no improvement then I think we can discuss this again at a later time.

Roo-B-Q'N
04-02-2008, 11:49 AM
FYI.... this just in..

i asked a question.... what is KCBS' anticipated return on investment of this venture. ???

The answer.
The entire project is funded by the sponsors. KCBS has not invested $$ in it.
ok.. good, so we(members) are not footing the bill.


So next question..

Does KCBS consider their name and reputation an investment in this venture?

Thats still open.

That is the $64,000 question right there. I would be interested in seeing the answer to that one.

Phil, thanks for asking the "tough" questions!!


I talked with somebody "in the know" and said person confirmed what Phil has said. KCBS, outside of name only has not paid a thing. They have loaned their name for an MMA Tour. All monies are from the advertisers on the truck.
Said person also said that the original idea for this tour was watered down and is nothing of what it was meant to be. However the trailer is solid and well crafted. Some items they are aware need replacing and will be done. Items like and electric food holder to ensure the hamburgers and hotdogs stay warm. The cambros were not doing that.
KCBS still has their neck and reputation on the line. Will be interesting to see how it all pans out.

scottyd
04-02-2008, 12:17 PM
What really is in a name. What is it really worth. Can the KCBS really with stand another black eye.

They must be able to because no matter what you and I think they are doing it. That is not going to change. We can talk type till the keys fall off the key board and it wont make one bit of difference.

I just sayin.