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Ford
01-18-2008, 07:15 AM
It's posted on the website. Proposal to ban electronically controlled thermostats. Proposal to ban garnish (again). Bunch of wording clarification including parboiling. Going ot be a fun discussion if you can attend. Wish I could be there.

http://www.kcbs.us/news.php?id=31

CharlieBeasley
01-18-2008, 07:44 AM
Want the thermostat make it hard on Stump elite, FEC100. and others to compete?

Lakeside Smoker
01-18-2008, 08:31 AM
Here's the proposed changes from the KCBS web site.

2008 Topics for discussion

1. Clarification of rule number 10 regarding the definition of “fine dice”.

2. More clearly define “electric grill” in rule number 5.

3. Ban the use of electronically controlled thermostats on smokers

4. Clarification of rule number 12 regarding the definition of ribs:

a. Add clarification for the definition of ribs.

b. Clarify an entry receiving 1’s across the board for rib meat without the
bones. (Why not just 1’s in appearance.)

5. Clarification on the definition of parboiling in rule number six.

6. Consideration for the evaluation of the smoke ring when considering appearance, pertaining to rule number 3 of the Judging Procedures.

7. Team signage at events.

8. Refinement of rule number 5 regarding the definition of a cooker.

9. Ban the use of chemical enhancements in competition meat.

10. New rule regarding the use of utensils during judging.

11. Prohibit distribution of left over contest entry food.

12. Abolish garnish.

drbbq
01-18-2008, 08:45 AM
Want the thermostat make it hard on Stump elite, FEC100. and others to compete?

Yes and I'm sure that's the whole point. If someone sends a letter their issue will be discussed so someone must have sent a letter regarding this, and all the other issues that are listed as well.

CharlieBeasley
01-18-2008, 10:55 AM
Thanks Doc Next it will be grills or should I have said BGEs

Wizards of 'Que
01-18-2008, 11:10 AM
Ray, that is not true. They completely ignored my letter about banning aluminium foil. :-D

3 and 9 would be big changes, but won't happen. Not that I think they should. Boy, I sure hate to miss such an exciting meeting!

Jeff_in_KC
01-18-2008, 11:14 AM
Thermostats on smokers? Will never happen because the pellet people know it would mean they couldn't use their pellet poopers if that was enacted. I think this is just another angle being taken by the anti-pellet people thinking if this is sneaked in, they could say "Hey, that includes pellet smokers".

Ban garnish? PUH-LEASE! This is a lame, tired issue. It's simple: if you don't want to use garnish, don't use it. If you don't believe it makes a difference, why worry about someone who does use it?

Team Signage? WTF is this about? Anyone know?

Damn, I might have to find a way to get there afterall. This ought to be hot enough to melt the snow we got in a mile radius of the Sheraton.

Kung Fu BBQ
01-18-2008, 11:16 AM
11. Prohibit distribution of left over contest entry food.

What reason would they have for that?

Transformer BBQ
01-18-2008, 11:22 AM
The signage one is about some contests that don't allow teams to display advertising... at least that's what I read somewhere. They want to have it in the KCBS rules so that if the contest is sanctiond, an organizer can't restrict a team from putting up a banner for a company that may have paid that particulars team entry fee.

Define ribs? has this been an issue?

Chemicals... this isn't going to happen... salt is a chemical... or are they upset about the HGH "the big teams" use?

Jeff_in_KC
01-18-2008, 11:23 AM
11. Prohibit distribution of left over contest entry food.

What reason would they have for that?

I'm guessing that's a fancy way of saying no coolers.

Jeff_in_KC
01-18-2008, 11:27 AM
The signage one is about some contests that don't allow teams to display advertising... at least that's what I read somewhere. They want to have it in the KCBS rules so that if the contest is sanctiond, an organizer can't restrict a team from putting up a banner for a company that may have paid that particulars team entry fee.


Oh OK gotcha. I haven't seen that occur around here. Heck, we compete at Platte City, MO where one of the contest sponsors is a competing real estate company to my sponsor and I was never asked to remove a sign. Where does this happen?

KC_Bobby
01-18-2008, 11:33 AM
Team Signage? WTF is this about? Anyone know?


I read on another forum something about it having to do with team banners and other signage that include logos, names, sponsorships, etc that are not necessarily sponsors of the KCBS. Something the new ad agency is trying to inact as an effort to get more KCBS sponsorship money. If that's the case, it's farkin bullchit. An easy example (based on my understanding so correct me if I'm wrong) would be that not even Plowboy wouldn't be able to promote his rubs on his signage unless he paid sponsorship to the KCBS.

Somewhere along the line, someone forgot that KCBS is a 501. Now I don't know the facts, but I wouldn't be entirely surprised if the ad agency contract is written up that they earn a percentage of the sponsorship money and/or get a bonus if the total membership increases by X percent (which would go hand in hand with the $25 additional fee to non-members at comps).

If this is the case, it's somewhat concerning that the ad agency is making recommendations that benefit themselves, not necessarily the KCBS. If anyone else agrees that this is a concern and are going to be present at the meetings this weekend - it's probably worth asking a few questions.

Again - I have no knowledge of this being the case, but it never hurts the organization to question the goals of the agency they've hired.

Jeff_in_KC
01-18-2008, 11:46 AM
Interesting stuff, Bob. I wait with anticipation the day MMA Marketing asks me to remove my sponsor banners. Guaranteed to not be pretty.

Bob are you going to be there?

KC_Bobby
01-18-2008, 12:00 PM
No, I kind of wish I could make the rules meeting - but I probably wouldn't voice anything - I feel too new.

I just want to say again that I could be off base with the advertising agencies contract. I worked at an agency for nearly a decade and I did hear stories from multiple clients that did have contracts of these types prior to working with the agency I was at. And almost always, the big picture goal of the client/organization gets lost/overlooked due the the agency recommending tactical methods that fulfill the goals short-term, then bite them in the butt-long term.

I hope I'm not coming off as accusing anyone (rereading my post, I can see how one could read it that way), maybe it's that I (and likely other members) do not fully understand the goals the KCBS is trying to achieve. If something's been written in the Bullsheet about big picture goals and the plan to achieve the goals, I must have missed it.

Wizards of 'Que
01-18-2008, 12:14 PM
Actually, some contest have rules against sponsor banners. The point is if a company sponsors a contest, there should not be a bunch of compeditors signs at a contests. Frankly, I can't see where this is any of KCBS's business. It should be the organizer's call.

Jeff_in_KC
01-18-2008, 12:18 PM
I should be there by 3:30 just in time to hear the garnish debate. LOL!

KC_Bobby
01-18-2008, 12:27 PM
Actually, some contest have rules against sponsor banners. The point is if a company sponsors a contest, there should not be a bunch of compeditors signs at a contests. Frankly, I can't see where this is any of KCBS's business. It should be the organizer's call.

This makes a lot more sense that how I understood the issue. I understand the concerns, but other organizations work around this. For instance. NASCAR has Coca-Cola as a sponsor, but Hendrick has a Pepsi car. NASCAR is named after Sprint/Nextel, they have an Alltel car and not sure if Cingular is coming back this year, but have had them too.

In other words, I'm not in agreement with the event even controlling the signage within a competitors booth. The booth space wasn't free, someone paid for it - either being the competitor or their sponsor. If the event provides the space, meat, other supplies for free, then I'm willing to re-evaluate my position.

Wizards of 'Que
01-18-2008, 01:09 PM
Not sure the analogy is relevant , but when Bud sponsors a contest or concert they require exclusivity. They will not put money into an event just to have Miller coattail advertising onto the event. If an organizer feels they need to enforce exclusivity, they should have a right. After all, contest sponsors are the life’s blood of prize money.

Kung Fu BBQ
01-18-2008, 01:26 PM
If I'm correct, the meeting was yesterday.

I would of gone had I known. I should check that site more being a member and all.

Transformer BBQ
01-18-2008, 01:34 PM
Here where I read about the sponser thing... not my words:

"Posted by Green Egg Dan on January 04, 2008 at 21:03:00:

I just sent this to rgray@kcbs.us for the upcoming annual rules meeting.
"Cook teams participating in a KCBS sanctioned event will be allowed to have their sponsors’ names, products or promotional materials, displayed, visible, or demonstrated in the competitors cook area." Some cook teams have their own products that they promote, and other teams are looking for sponsors to help with the cost of a competition. If we are not allowed to promote our sponsors, they have no reason to pay us for being there. I believe our sanctioning body needs to protect us in this area. "

Ford
01-18-2008, 01:35 PM
If I'm correct, the meeting was yesterday.

I would of gone had I known. I should check that site more being a member and all.
Per Rod Gray's post on another Forum the meeting is today at 2pm Central time at the Sheraton and it's not being held at the bar.

KC_Bobby
01-18-2008, 01:44 PM
Here where I read about the sponser thing... not my words:

"Posted by Green Egg Dan on January 04, 2008 at 21:03:00:

I just sent this to rgray@kcbs.us for the upcoming annual rules meeting.
"Cook teams participating in a KCBS sanctioned event will be allowed to have their sponsors’ names, products or promotional materials, displayed, visible, or demonstrated in the competitors cook area." Some cook teams have their own products that they promote, and other teams are looking for sponsors to help with the cost of a competition. If we are not allowed to promote our sponsors, they have no reason to pay us for being there. I believe our sanctioning body needs to protect us in this area. "

That, I like and agree with!

Transformer BBQ
01-19-2008, 10:23 AM
Anyone attend? Anyone give any summary of what happened?