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View Full Version : Racial Composition of Teams???? (Interesting Split)


Bigmista
12-06-2006, 06:14 PM
I'm guessing that you have a thing for skinny girls with flat butts. :lol:

Please don't take this as a racial statement but is there a reason why black people don't barbecue in texas? Or do they just not compete?

I know that we are a minority on the competition circuit in general but I just looked at close to 500 of your pictures from 3 different contests and I only saw one black guy and I almost missed him because he was light.

This is probably fodder for a whole different thread but why do you thik that is? Lack of funds? Lack of interest?

Please don't feel like you have to walk on eggshells around this or me. I'm a big boy and I'm asking for honest opinions.

big brother smoke
12-06-2006, 06:39 PM
Ok, try this

http://adobe.kodakgallery.com/Slideshow.jsp?mode=fromshare&Uc=2wibmj4j.2ol1bmmj&Uy=pgp45v&Ux=0 (http://adobe.kodakgallery.com/Slideshow.jsp?mode=fromshare&Uc=2wibmj4j.2ol1bmmj&Uy=pgp45v&Ux=0)

Thanks for sharing!

I also pondered Mista's question.

Dustaway
12-06-2006, 07:33 PM
I'm guessing that you have a thing for skinny girls with flat butts. :lol:

Please don't take this as a racial statement but is there a reason why black people don't barbecue in texas? Or do they just not compete?

I know that we are a minority on the competition circuit in general but I just looked at close to 500 of your pictures from 3 different contests and I only saw one black guy and I almost missed him because he was light.

This is probably fodder for a whole different thread but why do you thik that is? Lack of funds? Lack of interest?

Please don't feel like you have to walk on eggshells around this or me. I'm a big boy and I'm asking for honest opinions.

I am new fairly new to this but have done my far share of large events and so far have only ran across one all black team ? sometime you might see one fellow helping or something like that but not to many compete and I can't answer as to why

The_Kapn
12-06-2006, 08:15 PM
I'm guessing that you have a thing for skinny girls with flat butts. :lol:

Please don't take this as a racial statement but is there a reason why black people don't barbecue in texas? Or do they just not compete?

I know that we are a minority on the competition circuit in general but I just looked at close to 500 of your pictures from 3 different contests and I only saw one black guy and I almost missed him because he was light.

This is probably fodder for a whole different thread but why do you thik that is? Lack of funds? Lack of interest?

Please don't feel like you have to walk on eggshells around this or me. I'm a big boy and I'm asking for honest opinions.

Neil,
That is a damn good question.
I do not have an answer.

We have a couple of black "team members" down here, but I am not aware of any totally black teams.
May have missed them.

With that said, I judged Quincey FL this spring. Quincey is a black dominated (numerically) small town in the FL Panhandle. I think there were only 13 Pro teams, but probably 20+ Backyard teams and Vendors. Most of the BackYard and Vendors were "local" and predominately Black.
I did not taste any of their Que (I was kinda full), but it damn sure looked and smelled good! Long lines waiting to be served.
They had some HUGE cookers. Cookers tended to be home made and not sophisticated. This area is not rich, for sure.
But, they damn sure put out good looking and smelling Que.

I have never sensed any feeling of excluding anyone at the comps, either FBA or KCBS. When black team members "walk", they are congratulated with "high fives" and all of that the same as anyone.

I guess it may just be a matter of culture that will evolve with time.

When y'all are the GC at the Royal, Jack, or BOTB; maybe it will inspire others to strive for competitive excellence in the circuit :lol:

Enough.

TIM

Moderator's Note:
If this develops into a productive sub-thread, I will split it.

3970010
12-06-2006, 09:55 PM
I'm guessing that you have a thing for skinny girls with flat butts. :lol:

Please don't take this as a racial statement but is there a reason why black people don't barbecue in texas? Or do they just not compete?

I know that we are a minority on the competition circuit in general but I just looked at close to 500 of your pictures from 3 different contests and I only saw one black guy and I almost missed him because he was light.

This is probably fodder for a whole different thread but why do you thik that is? Lack of funds? Lack of interest?

Please don't feel like you have to walk on eggshells around this or me. I'm a big boy and I'm asking for honest opinions.

Thats funny right there. I have a thing for girls period. Mind ya, I love my wife and she knows it so she dont ever have a problem with me and my camera or my flirtin.

As to Black BBQ teams, you got me there. I have seen about 3 so far but I have only done 12 contest (this was my first year). Its a good question, I just dont know the answer. I am glad yall liked the pictures.

Bigmista
12-06-2006, 11:15 PM
My team isn't all black. We are definitely the rainbow coalition.
http://www.thesurvivalgourmet.com/images/Autry/Autry91.jpg

However I do know of 3 all black teams in California. The Rib Doctor, Sug's Shack and The Change Smokers. Not many other black people competing here either. It's not that I ever felt uncomfortable in anyway and I have always been welcomed with open arms. Just wondering.

chad
12-07-2006, 08:09 AM
My team isn't all black. We are definitely the rainbow coalition.
http://www.thesurvivalgourmet.com/images/Autry/Autry91.jpg

However I do know of 3 all black teams in California. The Rib Doctor, Sug's Shack and The Change Smokers. Not many other black people competing here either. It's not that I ever felt uncomfortable in anyway and I have always been welcomed with open arms. Just wondering.

I've been asking about this very issue for a couple of years. Knowing the black influence in BBQ it is amazing that more black teams don't compete. Actually, I first noticed it at Asbury Park, NJ, in 2004. One black guy soloing...I'd walk by every now and then during the night to make sure he was "ok" and didn't go completely to sleep!!

It could be finances, it could be that the black cooks don't feel the need to compete. I've talked to a couple of black cooks and they just shrug and basically say, "I don't know either".

At Douglas, GA, there were quite a few black teams...all local and only a couple competed in the "pro" division. However, the teams did pretty well with walks and like Tim said, they all got cheers and high-fives from everyone.

I don't have an answer. I've got some theories, but they are just that and NO, I don't think it's a conspiracy!!

BrooklynQ
12-07-2006, 11:31 AM
Neil, I'm wodering if it has to do with how black folk raise their kids. It may be a cultural thing.

My Cuban grandmother thought it was wrong that I liked to cook. Men didn't do that she'd tell me. It was woman's work. Hence, my father or uncles on that side have no idea how to cook. Neither do my male cousins on that side of the family.

Me - I grew up in a house where my mother worked 2 jobs, and I liked to eat, so I learned how to cook.

It could also be just a matter of where most black folk live. I could be wrong, but I think the majority of black folk live in cities. Which you and I know isn't exactly condusive to BBQ.

Bigmista
12-07-2006, 11:47 AM
Yeah but all of those contests in the pictures were in Texas. I know there are black folx in the country there. Hell I'm related to them.

3970010
12-07-2006, 12:33 PM
Yeah but all of those contests in the pictures were in Texas. I know there are black folx in the country there. Hell I'm related to them.Even though I have a Houston address I actually am in the county. In my neighborhood the plots are not smaller than 5 acres. We are an equal mix of Hispanics, Blacks, and Whites. We all BBQ, I just seem to be the only one who competes. That being said, I dont BBQ at home much. I am much to busy. For instance I am on the way to a clients site now (I have hired a driver and a laptop mounted my truck). I work an insane amount of hours (family business). The Black guy on the corner BBQ's at least 3 or 4 times a week and you can tell his family (I am making the assumption its his family) is over all the time and thats what they do. I have asked him about competing and he seems interested but never really puts a foot forward.

Bigmista
12-07-2006, 02:29 PM
Hmmm...I guess it's just a reluctance to take the first step. Maybe a fear of failure? Don't know. I know I don't live like that. Maybe they just don't want to try anything new. Set in their ways.

The_Kapn
12-07-2006, 04:46 PM
Moderator' Note:

This has taken a life of it's own and deserves it's own thread.
Please treat it with respect.

TIM

Wine & Swine
12-07-2006, 04:55 PM
Everyone at Hudson Valley got to meet our black team member, Chris, who unfortunatley, can not cook and just likes to walk around the comps drinking wine and wearing orange clogs. I think barbeque is like hockey, except with less Canadians.

Solidkick
12-07-2006, 05:10 PM
Even as popular as contests are in the midwest, and speaking for the ones I've attended, I can only think of 2 teams with minority members, and both are very accomplished cooks.

Mista brings up a good question.....I've never given this much thought....

VitaminQ
12-07-2006, 05:14 PM
This is really interesting. At the couple of comps I've been to, I haven't noticed a lot of black competitors. The Billy Sims team had a couple of black guys, IIRC (Billy himself was not on site). That being said, there are definitely a lot of black barbeque cooks in Tulsa. The three best BBQ joints in tows are black-owned and operated.

Now, I am neither black, or a competitor, or anything but an occasionally lucky cooker of bbq. I'm certainly not an expert on anything, but here's a theory that just occured to me: bbq is seen as a traditionally black food around these parts. And that seems reasonable to me. For a long, unfortunate time, blacks were not in good shape, socioeconomically. BBQ is not haute cuisine; it's survival food. So if bbq is traditionally black, could there be a backlash against white society co-opting it on the competition circuit? A refusal to participate?

I don't know. And I hope I've explained my little theory adequately. Bear in mind that I'm usually talking out of my a$$.

tumpedover
12-07-2006, 06:20 PM
I'm guessing that you have a thing for skinny girls with flat butts. :lol:

Please don't take this as a racial statement but is there a reason why black people don't barbecue in texas? Or do they just not compete?

I know that we are a minority on the competition circuit in general but I just looked at close to 500 of your pictures from 3 different contests and I only saw one black guy and I almost missed him because he was light.

This is probably fodder for a whole different thread but why do you thik that is? Lack of funds? Lack of interest?

Please don't feel like you have to walk on eggshells around this or me. I'm a big boy and I'm asking for honest opinions.

I don't know about the competition part of the question,but as for the question of why don't black people barbecue in Texas???? Not really valid,Especially in East texas where I'm from. I would say a majority of east Texas Barbecue joints are black owned,and make some of the damn finest Q i've ever tasted I might add.
I'm not sure about the competition thing, but I would have to say that I wish some of the black Q'ers I know of in East Texas would get into the comp's . It might just change the "complexion" (pun intended) of the comp's themselves.

Jorge
12-07-2006, 06:27 PM
If I had to guess I'd say a combination of disposable income (and that term couldn't be more correct in competition cooking) and available time. I can start a list of places that are owned by black Americans that serve an outstanding product here in Texas. During the time I was cooking with a buddy that was infected with the competition disease I saw the same thing you have. I remember a team or two that was all black, and a handfull of others that were members of other teams.

Interesting question.

Bigmista
12-07-2006, 06:41 PM
That would seem out of character because everyone I know seems to think that they know how to BBQ better than anybody. Or Great Uncle Eisenhower or Pee-Paw or Cousin Darnell with the lazy eye makes the best BBQ in the family. Of course now that I know what good BBQ really is, I'm finding that this is rarely true. But I digress.

I would think that competition would be right up our collective alley, for bragging rights if nothing else.

Maybe it's not cool or flashy enough? But if they saw some of the pits and setups out there, it would change their minds.

Imagine pits and trailers with hydraulics and gold trim. DVD players and sound systems. Wait, they have that already so that can't be it.

*sigh*

I'm out of ideas. Anyone else?

Bigmista
12-07-2006, 06:47 PM
Thanks for sharing!

I also pondered Mista's question.

Did you come up with any answers or even theories?

MilitantSquatter
12-07-2006, 06:52 PM
Found this from Google search.... Here's an article from the Houston Press from 2003...
The author is the same guy who wrote Legends of Texas Barbeque Cookbook that many of us own a copy of.

I copied and pasted the first page but there is five more pages and I did not want to have a really long post..

http://www.houstonpress.com/issues/2003-05-01/news/feature.html

Barbecue in Black and White

Carving the racism out of Texas barbecue mythology

By Robb Walsh (http://www.houstonpress.com/feedback/index.php?author_email=robb@robbwalsh.com&headline=Barbecue%20in%20Black%20and%20White&issuedate=2003-05-01)

Article Published May 1, 2003



The judges at the Houston rodeo barbecue cook-off are predominantly white. And so are the judging standards.


Thanks to events like the Miss Blue Jeans Contest, the barbecue cook-off has been likened to a redneck Mardi Gras. Cowgirls are taking turns climbing onto the stage and turning around to display their denim-clad derrieres to the audience. It's the Miss Blue Jeans Contest at the Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo barbecue cook-off. When a woman wiggles provocatively, the men wave their cowboy hats in the air and roar in approval. The women are all white. And so are the hundred or so guys standing in front of the stage. The cowboy next to me is wearing a colorful necklace of plastic Confederate flags. The atmosphere of a typical cook-off has been described as a redneck Mardi Gras. It's easy to see why.

As the pageant winds down, I wander the grounds taking in the sights. In front of one barbecue booth there's a huge wooden sign with "Confederated Cookers" carved across the Rebel flag. Right around the corner I stumble upon the Skinner Lane Gang busily taking barbecue off the smoker. I stand there staring at them in awe. They are the first all-black barbecue cook-off team I've ever seen. One of them invites me to come in and sit down.
This isn't the Skinner Lane Gang's first big rodeo. They won the overall championship trophy here in 1994. And they hope to win it again this time, they tell me. First, I sample a healthy pile of their brisket and a few excellent ribs. Then I start asking questions.
"How many black teams are entered this year?" I want to know.
"I think there's two or three," says team leader Louis Archendaux. There are 430 teams entered in this year's contest, according to organizers; they have no record of how many are black.
The main reason blacks don't enter barbecue cook-offs is money, says Archendaux, who runs his own chemical company in Sugar Land. "You've got to know somebody. We don't have any sponsors -- except for friends and relatives who help us out with a few bucks here and there." Although the entry fee is only $650, a mandatory million-dollar liability insurance policy, tent and table rentals, ice, and food and beverage expenses run up the tab. "We have one of the littlest booths out here. We are barely getting by with $5,000 or $6,000," Archendaux tells me.
The team's booth is furnished with a few picnic tables and a small bar. There are about a dozen invited guests of various races sitting around eating barbecue and drinking beer.
"How do you decide who to invite in?" I ask.
"We set up folding chairs outside here and watch for hungry people who don't have wristbands," chuckles a team member. "You can tell by the look on their face that they have no idea what's going on. So we bring them in and give them some barbecue."
Anyone foolish enough to come to the Houston rodeo barbecue cook-off without a corporate wristband gets a pathetic chopped barbecue sandwich, a scoop of industrial cole slaw and some tasteless beans served on a Styrofoam plate at the public tent. A $6 general admission ticket also allows them to walk around and peek into the invitation-only tents. Sponsors use these to entertain and raise money for worthy causes -- and that's where the competition-quality barbecue, live bands and open bars are.
For barbecue buffs who lack corporate connections, the Skinner Lane Gang booth is a tiny outpost of real-world charity. I take a second helping of brisket, which is very tender and cut into irregular chunks. I'm curious about how it will fare in the judging. Archendaux tells me the brisket they will enter in the contest is sliced completely differently.
"Do you change your regular cooking style for the competition?" I ask.
"You have to," says Archendaux. "If you get it really tender, you can't slice it perfectly. And appearance is very important to the judges."
"Are any of the judges black?" I wonder.
"Probably not," he says. A visit to the judging booth confirms Archendaux's suspicions: There may be a black judge somewhere, but the 60 or 70 I can see are all white.
Although many barbecue cook-off organizers would like to see more black teams participate, African-Americans are discouraged by the white-dominated judging standards and the frat boy atmosphere -- and then there are the Confederate flags.
"Two years ago, when that flap was going on over in South Carolina, barbecue teams started flying Confederate flags here in Houston," says Archendaux. "Somebody complained and the livestock show folks told the teams to take down the flags." Confederate flags are still banned at the Houston rodeo cook-off.
"Flags don't bother me," says Archendaux. The Skinner Lane Gang has been breaking the color barrier at Texas barbecue cook-offs for going on 20 years now. "We were the first black team at the Fort Bend County Cook-off in 1984," Archendaux says. "They had Confederate flags flying all over the place."
"Did anybody give you trouble?" I ask.
"There's always a few *******s," shrugs Archendaux. "But we're kind of rowdy. If you want to take it there, we can help you out. We never minded a little scrape."
The BP World's Championship Bar-B-Que Contest at the Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo, as it is officially known, doesn't discriminate against African-Americans, its organizers tell me on the phone. If very few blacks choose to participate, well, that's just the way things work out. But Houston's barbecue contest is symptomatic of the historic racial divide that runs through the middle of Texas barbecue with far more serious consequences. This division wasn't the result of intentional racism, either. It's just that according to Texas mythology, barbecue belongs to white people.

Continued.....See link for the rest of the pages from the article...

Bigmista
12-07-2006, 06:55 PM
If I had to guess I'd say a combination of disposable income (and that term couldn't be more correct in competition cooking) and available time.

That could be it. I know I couldn't afford to compete by myself. At least right now, anyway. But that's why we put together our team to share the expense. Maybe that is the issue right there. It always pains me that we don't have enough trust in our communities to work together. It's an, "If can't have all of it, I don't want any of it" attitude. I see other ethnic groups working together and getting ahead and we just can't seem to work it out. Maybe the BBQ circuit is a small reflection of society at large.

(This is a generalization. I know there are exceptions to the rule both good and bad.)

Sawdustguy
12-07-2006, 06:56 PM
We are easy. Our heritage is in our name. We are just a couple of Polocks. What could be easier?

big brother smoke
12-07-2006, 07:07 PM
Partial Theory (I also agree with the city slicker theory): Same reason we do not have a lot of black members on the BBQ forums. I was a little apprehensive about joining BBQ forums earlier this year (join some, but never stayed for more than a coupla weeks), because I knew I could hear some uncomfortable discussions from folks who rightfully/wrongfully are stereotyped as "rednecks."

However, I got a few friends who consider themselves "rednecks" and I get along with them just fine.

Additionally, I bought a home 2.5 years ago in a rural area and had the same aforementioned apprehension. I got over it after a month or so of meeting the neighbors and such. Now it will be easier/more comfortable for another black family to move to the area.

I also was reluctant about competing, but Mista has got me feening to enter a comp or two. So, as more folks like Mista and me get out there the more black folks will join as well.

BTW: I do feel at home here and stayed on because the day after I joined I realized Mista was like me. Remember the Spaghetti porn thread started by Joe in May. http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17531

Mista said Joe's spaghetti was "white folks spaghetti" and then folks like Hodedo, Fat Daddy, Qman, Sledneck and few others said they must be black because they make black folk spaghetti too. Well that's the day, I knew I was in the right place for me.

Just my .02, thanks for listening!

arlieque
12-07-2006, 08:48 PM
Mista, we had several teams at the Autry last year and I know all but one are coming back. Darrell isnt coming due to the need to spent more time with his wife and kids. I have been thinking about your question and dont have a answer for you but what I was wondering was who told you you could cook good bbq? Just kidding, love you man and see you in April. I will also be in town in late Feb if you want to meet at Roscos for chicken and waffles? Yep I know were a brother likes to eat! Been there many a time!

Arlie

Merl
12-07-2006, 09:02 PM
I dont't know about this tread, but I know two Moe's one from Grand Rapids and one from Des Moines. They will kick your butt.

I rarely notice the ethinicity of a team,
but I do always pay attention to the pretty girls,
especially those petite skinny ones, and the not so petite ones, and the.... well I just pay attention to all the bbq babes on the circuit, cause they are hot and spice. I love them all.
Opps now dont tell Carol. Oh wait she might be one of the petite ones.
Merl

arlieque
12-07-2006, 09:06 PM
Merl, You are like me: I give equal attention to all. Big, Tall, Fat or Small!

big brother smoke
12-07-2006, 09:19 PM
Merl, You are like me: I give equal attention to all. Big, Tall, Fat or Small!

Talk about diversity!

jgh1204
12-07-2006, 09:32 PM
In my area, there are very few blacks period. It is kind of weird. I think the population is 85% hispanic, 14% white and 1% other.

Sawdustguy
12-07-2006, 10:28 PM
It definetely sucks. There is a whole bunch of people who don't compete or for that matter, judge. Instead of us sitting on our ass, trying not to hurt each others feelings, lets make this work and figure out how we can get more of every nationality involved. I could give a chit less who parks themselves next to us and starts competing. Hell lets cook, drink and have a good time. I don't care if you have green skin and burp through your navel.

Bigmista
12-07-2006, 10:55 PM
Mista, we had several teams at the Autry last year and I know all but one are coming back. Darrell isnt coming due to the need to spent more time with his wife and kids. I have been thinking about your question and dont have a answer for you but what I was wondering was who told you you could cook good bbq? Just kidding, love you man and see you in April. I will also be in town in late Feb if you want to meet at Roscos for chicken and waffles? Yep I know were a brother likes to eat! Been there many a time!

Arlie

Looking forward to it! MrsMista used to work at the one on main. WAAAAYYYY in the hood! I'd be proud and honored to take you there.

Bigmista
12-07-2006, 11:01 PM
Please believe that I am not trying to start any controversy. But I do like to stimulate conversation. I've never felt the need to bite my tongue here and I think of the folks here as family. I've never felt excluded, exploited or singled out in any way. I just want to promote BBQ as a cuisine, a sport and a way of life because Q'ers are some of the best people in the world.

They're also a bunch of farkers, but that's another thread.

JohnMcD348
12-07-2006, 11:50 PM
I haven't read every post here yet, but I promise I will.


You kow, my wife asked me that very same question when she went to her first Competition here in Lakeland. PigFest is one of the larger cmops around these parts and it also happens to sit right in the predominantly black neighborhood. She asked me a couple of days after the comp and I couldn't really come up with a logical answer. To be honest, I hadn't even thought of it until she asked. It wasn't even that there wer not any predominantly black competitors, the crowd there was very predominantly white. the best I could come up with was maybe a reverse aversion to stereotyping. I don't know, it's late and I guess I really need to take time to collect my thoughts so they don't sound so much like jibberish right now. been working for quite a few hours straight with very litttle rest between takes.

3970010
12-08-2006, 05:58 AM
Just so you guys know, I am a proud REDNECK. Yep. Nothin but trucks in the driveway. Weapons in the house like you wouldnt believe. Dare I say I love the Confederate flag? I do. Its part of my heritage and believe it or not the civil war was not fought over slavery like is taught in history class.

Do I think slavery was right? Heck no.
Am I hatefull to other races? Heck no
Do I believe its like the Bible says and all men are equal? Yes I do.
Am I proud to be White? Yep.
Do I believe in affirmative action? No, its wrong. (remember-all men are equal)

So, think of me how you want to. I like everybody. Dont care what color you are. I am not gonna rubber stamp everything though in an effort to get along. Ifin its wrong its wrong.

tjus77
12-08-2006, 06:17 AM
Don't compete here, but have gone to numerous competitions. I stated at the last one... damned shame their ain't more black teams, my favorite bar bq in town are both run by old black men (on the side of the road). If you are from the NW side of Harris county, you probably know Mr. Campbell. Learned about as much from them as I did from my days working in resturant.

tjus77
12-08-2006, 06:30 AM
Just so you guys know, I am a proud REDNECK. Yep. Nothin but trucks in the driveway. Weapons in the house like you wouldnt believe. Dare I say I love the Confederate flag? I do. Its part of my heritage and believe it or not the civil war was not fought over slavery like is taught in history class.

Do I think slavery was right? Heck no.
Am I hatefull to other races? Heck no
Do I believe its like the Bible says and all men are equal? Yes I do.
Am I proud to be White? Yep.
Do I believe in affirmative action? No, its wrong. (remember-all men are equal)

So, think of me how you want to. I like everybody. Dont care what color you are. I am not gonna rubber stamp everything though in an effort to get along. Ifin its wrong its wrong.

AMEN!!!!!!! and let me add, I HATE being PC. Don't get me wrong, I don't TRY to be offensive, but you know.... no matter how careful you are SOMEBODY will take offensive, just because this is America and you can.

MilitantSquatter
12-08-2006, 06:54 AM
Moderator Note:

Mista brought up a valid observation about competitions and the low turnout of black people participating in these contests and the reasons that may cause this...

Let's keep the posts on topic and not turn this into a bunch of posts about our personal beliefs, beliefs of what or what was not US history etc.

Thanks - MilitantSquatter

Q Haven
12-08-2006, 07:19 AM
My initial thought is that most competitions are held in rural or suburban areas, where mostly white people live. I feel that if more events were held in cities, or at least were more heavily promoted in cities, there would be a lot more diversity at competitions.

I think as BBQ continues to grow in popularity, you will see more participation. After all, I'm sure many would agree that some of the best Q restaurants out there are black owned, and I'm sure they will see that well attended competitions are a great way to promote their business.

3970010
12-08-2006, 07:34 AM
Moderator Note:

Mista brought up a valid observation about competitions and the low turnout of black people participating in these contests and the reasons that may cause this...

Let's keep the posts on topic and not turn this into a bunch of posts about our personal beliefs, beliefs of what or what was not US history etc.

Thanks - MilitantSquatter

Fair enough.

3970010
12-08-2006, 07:35 AM
If you are from the NW side of Harris county, you probably know Mr. Campbell. Learned about as much from them as I did from my days working in resturant.

Where exactly is his resturant? I would like to try it. I dont think I have ever been in a BBQ establishment that was owned and run by a Black man. I did see on the history channel how Blacks helped bring BBQ along. I was reading on the SBCA's website how they believe it was the Spanish and the American Indian who came up with BBQ in South Carolina. Little confused myself as to which one was correct. It could be interesting to find out. I have heard that ribs were a throw away meat and that Black slaves were the ones who discovered how to cook them. It does make one wonder why there is not more involvement with minorities. There is a huge Hispanic turnout here in the Houston area cookoffs.

Spydermike72
12-08-2006, 08:23 AM
As Merl stated earlier, there is a few all Black teams in Michigan, Big Moes, Donnies Smokehouse and I belive a fellow named Charlie here in the Flint area. They all compete here in Michigan. And as Merl also stated, they are dang good!!

Bigmista
12-08-2006, 08:29 AM
I asked MrsMista what she thought and she said it's possible that black folx that grew up in the country aren't that comfortable being around a lot of white folx, especially for that long a time. Old habits die hard. I guess they aren't aware of the camraderie we share.

Bigmista
12-08-2006, 08:32 AM
As Merl stated earlier, there is a few all Black teams in Michigan, Big Moes, Donnies Smokehouse and I belive a fellow named Charlie here in the Flint area. They all compete here in Michigan. And as Merl also stated, they are dang good!!

I don't think talent is an issue. We all know some black folks that can cook. Does anybody have any ideas on how to encourge the formation of more black teams?

tjus77
12-08-2006, 08:33 AM
Where exactly is his resturant? I would like to try it. I dont think I have ever been in a BBQ establishment that was owned and run by a Black man. I did see on the history channel how Blacks helped bring BBQ along. I was reading on the SBCA's website how they believe it was the Spanish and the American Indian who came up with BBQ in South Carolina. Little confused myself as to which one was correct. It could be interesting to find out. I have heard that ribs were a throw away meat and that Black slaves were the ones who discovered how to cook them. It does make one wonder why there is not more involvement with minorities. There is a huge Hispanic turnout here in the Houston area cookoffs.

The resturant I used to work at was in Pt Arthur and was run by a Korean man, go figure. Mr Campbell is a vendor on the side of the road in a blue trailer. Last I saw him was at a Sam's on 290. Don't know where he has been lately. The other black man moved also, and I don't remember where I saw him last. Seems like on 249 near Antoine, his trailer in maroon and sells some awesome smoked boudain.

Sylvie
12-08-2006, 11:02 AM
I've been following this thread. Lots of good reasons offered for lack of participation. This is one of those areas where you're not going to be able to come up with an easily defined explanation.
The whole BBQ competion thing is a combination of many things for all of us (Ijust happen to be black and the female component of Big Mista's team).
Exposure. Most competitors get into this by knowing someone who was competing or knowing someone who knows someone. Forums like this educate and expose, but you don't see many of us posting here. Maybe there are some lurkers. Big Mista's presence does a lot to ease the way for many of us to get involved. I wouldn't be on Four BBQ if he hadn't asked.
Equipment which is ready to travel. Most black folks I know who do BBQ don't have equipment they can load on a truck and haul all over.
Dollars- includes equipment cost and fees. Not an inexpensive sport.
Time- Need to be able to take time away from work to get to competition sites. Family time at home or travel with family is often a priority for those days off.
Comfort level with other ethnic groups. I even commented to Big Mista in the beginning on how does he fit in with you guys. Based on my life experiences (and I'm pretty global), it isn't something you would expect. I'm now more open minded.
Priorities- what's important to you? No one would deny that BBQ is not a prirority for eating and bragging rights are a plus but to show whose the best at cooking at a venue which may be perceived as "not like mine" may not be high up on the list. (example would be how much heat is in the sauce. What I cook at home is hot, competition sauces mild).

I'm through for now. Got to go to work.

Bigmista
12-08-2006, 11:20 AM
Sylvie brought up a good point about time. Think I'll start another thread...

Plowboy
12-08-2006, 11:56 AM
Please don't take this as a racial statement but is there a reason why black people don't barbecue in texas?


I've read this entire thread to this point. First comment is that you should ask some blacks this question. Most of us middle aged white guys can only guess.

The same question can be asked of women. Most women in comp BBQ were dragged into this because of their husbands. Some love it equally, others tolerate it, and others hate it. I know as few all chick BBQ teams as I do all Black or Asian teams. Funny that Hispanics are fairly represented, but harder to pick out in the crowd I think.

Plowboy
12-08-2006, 12:17 PM
Partial Theory (I also agree with the city slicker theory): Same reason we do not have a lot of black members on the BBQ forums. I was a little apprehensive about joining BBQ forums earlier this year (join some, but never stayed for more than a coupla weeks), because I knew I could hear some uncomfortable discussions from folks who rightfully/wrongfully are stereotyped as "rednecks."

However, I got a few friends who consider themselves "rednecks" and I get along with them just fine.

Additionally, I bought a home 2.5 years ago in a rural area and had the same aforementioned apprehension. I got over it after a month or so of meeting the neighbors and such. Now it will be easier/more comfortable for another black family to move to the area.

I also was reluctant about competing, but Mista has got me feening to enter a comp or two. So, as more folks like Mista and me get out there the more black folks will join as well.

BTW: I do feel at home here and stayed on because the day after I joined I realized Mista was like me. Remember the Spaghetti porn thread started by Joe in May. http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17531

Mista said Joe's spaghetti was "white folks spaghetti" and then folks like Hodedo, Fat Daddy, Qman, Sledneck and few others said they must be black because they make black folk spaghetti too. Well that's the day, I knew I was in the right place for me.

Just my .02, thanks for listening!

Here's my second comment on this thread.

I've been in Big Brotha's shoes where I've been out of my element. Every month I take my son Michael (who is black) to get his hair cut. Chit grows like crazy!!! I could go to some barber in our suburb and could probably find one who is also black. Instead, we go DOWNTOWN to a black owned, black operated, and black patroned barber shop. It is in the hood. Michael is almost 3 and has no concept of race yet. One day he will. He'll have friends. He'll have a wife. He'll have a family of inlaws... poor kid. Many of these people will likely be black as well. 99% of those folks will have grown up going to these kinds of barber shops every month and probably still will. He won't be able to relate at some of these deep levels with people of his own skin. This can lead to potential identity and relationship issues. My whole job as a father is to raise well adjusted sons. Like adoption, race differences will be something that we'll talk about throughout our lives. Every kid reacts differently. Best to be prepared and proactive.

The barber shop is such a cultural thing for blacks. One day, Michael will have an appreciation for that experience.

We'll getting to my point, I'm the only white guy... hell, the only non-black in the entire place. I may be the only white person that's been in that shop all week or month. The first time was a little weird, just like Brotha was saying. Each time, I got more comfortable, and I could tell that others were getting more comfortable with me being there. Some guys wanna talk with me and some don't. That's all fine. I can understand if someone feels like I'm trespassing on their ground or culture. Most people don't and most understand without discussing it, why I'm there.

It is a great experience. I love going there. Seems like I see something new or have a new story to tell each time I go. You get a new appreciation for people and an awareness of people when you step into their shoes.

Why is it that there is something in this country called Black Culture and Hispanic Culture... but no White Culture? Because White culture is what we are all exposed to. (I'm stealing this thought from a book I've read.) Some of us could use a little taste of "other" culture in our lives. Taking our kids to a daycare/school with hispanic teachers speaking spanish has also been great. My poor ass spanish is picking up.

So, I can see if stepping out into a white, middle aged, male dominated arena like comp BBQ is a little intimidating. We are typically comfortable with people who are like us because generational, geographical, and socioeconomical like minded ideals typically come along with that. We like our comfort zones.

Adios, amigos.

Plowboy
12-08-2006, 12:22 PM
Please don't take this as a racial statement but is there a reason why black people don't barbecue in texas? Or do they just not compete?

My last comment is...

I'm trying to raise a black comp bbq'er myself!!! Well, not in Texas, but he'll be in the MoKan area. I have a dream of my sons either taking over the team one day or having a team of their own like Andy Groneman taking the que from his dad.

big brother smoke
12-08-2006, 12:27 PM
Here's my second comment on this thread.

I've been in Big Brotha's shoes where I've been out of my element. Every month I take my son Michael (who is black) to get his hair cut. Chit grows like crazy!!! I could go to some barber in our suburb and could probably find one who is also black. Instead, we go DOWNTOWN to a black owned, black operated, and black patroned barber shop. It is in the hood. Michael is almost 3 and has no concept of race yet. One day he will. He'll have friends. He'll have a wife. He'll have a family of inlaws... poor kid. Many of these people will likely be black as well. 99% of those folks will have grown up going to these kinds of barber shops every month and probably still will. He won't be able to relate at some of these deep levels with people of his own skin. This can lead to potential identity and relationship issues. My whole job as a father is to raise well adjusted sons. Like adoption, race differences will be something that we'll talk about throughout our lives. Every kid reacts differently. Best to be prepared and proactive.

The barber shop is such a cultural thing for blacks. One day, Michael will have an appreciation for that experience.

We'll getting to my point, I'm the only white guy... hell, the only non-black in the entire place. I may be the only white person that's been in that shop all week or month. The first time was a little weird, just like Brotha was saying. Each time, I got more comfortable, and I could tell that others were getting more comfortable with me being there. Some guys wanna talk with me and some don't. That's all fine. I can understand if someone feels like I'm trespassing on their ground or culture. Most people don't and most understand without discussing it, why I'm there.

It is a great experience. I love going there. Seems like I see something new or have a new story to tell each time I go. You get a new appreciation for people and an awareness of people when you step into their shoes.

Why is it that there is something in this country called Black Culture and Hispanic Culture... but no White Culture? Because White culture is what we are all exposed to. (I'm stealing this thought from a book I've read.) Some of us could use a little taste of "other" culture in our lives. Taking our kids to a daycare/school with hispanic teachers speaking spanish has also been great. My poor ass spanish is picking up.

So, I can see if stepping out into a white, middle aged, male dominated arena like comp BBQ is a little intimidating. We are typically comfortable with people who are like us because generational, geographical, and socioeconomical like minded ideals typically come along with that. We like our comfort zones.

Adios, amigos.

I can actually picture what you are saying. We owned two barber shops in the hood. One by my mom and the other by my Grandfather and Dad.

The patriarchs have sinced passed and my mom is still barbering on the south side of Chicago. You gotta to love the conversations that go on in there.

Bigmista
12-08-2006, 12:37 PM
I guess I'm just a little bit different because I just like to have a good time and it doesn't matter who it's with. MrsMista thinks I'm crazy cause I wake up in the morning dancing by myself.

I celebrate everybody's holidays. I'm Irish on St. Patricks day. I'm Mexican on Cinco de Mayo. Hell if they had a party, I'd be Jewish on Yom Kippur. I've never been afraid to go out and experience someone else's culture and probably look pretty goofy doing it. Might be why I feel comfortable here.

If that makes other people feel comfortable and open more doors, then so be it.

Smokin Gator
12-08-2006, 12:57 PM
I have really enjoyed reading the post on this thread. It has certainly not something that had ever occured to me, but I can tell you that whether you get it a competition or not you owe it to yourself to get some Q cooked by old time black cooks.

Having grown up in rural north Florida with lots of blacks I have been eating at black owned joints all my life. Probably eight of my top ten spots are owned by blacks and they are in predominately black sections of the town. Lots of whites in the past wouldn't go to them just because where they were located. Their loss. I never cared... the Q was so good!

One of my favorites no longer exists but it was in Gainesville Florida for at least 40 years or so. It was named Prez and Ed's. My dad ate there in the 40's and I used to eat there all the time in the early 80's. I would always get the bbq goat and kept asking for the sauce to be hotter (spicier). After a few times it got to be a fun running competition... I'd order, the person at the counter would turn around and say to the cooks "That white boy is here wanting some hot goat." The cooks made it hotter every time and I kept asking for it hotter. I guess the had some fun watching me sweat in my plate 'cause they would laugh like heck. They loved having me there though and I learned a heck of a lot from them.

I still know of several black families that Q almost every weekend. Lots of family and friends stop by and eat and visit. A couple have built small tin roofed sheds just so everyone can sit out of the weather and enjoy the sharing. I think many of us have gotten too busy to enjoy that kind of Qing. Maybe they have the idea!

To me it really doesn't matter whether any of those folks ever choose to compete. I know how good they can cook and will continue to support them.

I know this got a little rambly but I kind of got touched at how much I have learned about Qing from people in my past and several of them were black. I certainly appreciate it and couldn't care less what the color of their skin is.

Dustaway
12-08-2006, 12:58 PM
Bigmista you are welcome in my camp anytime you get your traveling shoe's on :biggrin: and that goes to any of my fellow brethren brothers out their


I guess I'm just a little bit different because I just like to have a good time and it doesn't matter who it's with. MrsMista thinks I'm crazy cause I wake up in the morning dancing by myself.

I celebrate everybody's holidays. I'm Irish on St. Patricks day. I'm Mexican on Cinco de Mayo. Hell if they had a party, I'd be Jewish on Yom Kippur. I've never been afraid to go out and experience someone else's culture and probably look pretty goofy doing it. Might be why I feel comfortable here.

If that makes other people feel comfortable and open more doors, then so be it.

Bigmista
12-08-2006, 01:25 PM
Bigmista you are welcome in my camp anytime you get your traveling shoe's on :biggrin: and that goes to any of my fellow brethren brothers out their

I have no doubt that just about everyone here feels the same way.

bbqbull
12-08-2006, 02:27 PM
Bigmista you are welcome in my camp anytime you get your traveling shoe's on :biggrin: and that goes to any of my fellow brethren brothers out their

I feel the same way as Dustaway does. Skin to me is only a color. I veiw it the same as different colored clothing,houses and automobiles.
Heck ive met more mean and nasty folks that are white.

I love to have fun and I have friends of many colors that are my true friends.:-P

Mike

Plowboy
12-08-2006, 02:31 PM
I can actually picture what you are saying. We owned two barber shops in the hood. One by my mom and the other by my Grandfather and Dad.

The patriarchs have sinced passed and my mom is still barbering on the south side of Chicago. You gotta to love the conversations that go on in there.

Since our barber moved to a new shop, it isn't as lively. He's younger and cuts all of the kids and young men. Now, at the old shop, the old guys would sit in the back with the 60 something barber. Now those guys could talk about nothing all damn day. They didn't sensor themselves because I was there, either. I'm a shut your mouth and listen kinda guy anyway.

One morning we were their early and were the first ones in the front of the shop. The lights weren't even on. We can in the front door and startled them. They thought someone was coming in to rob them... so one guy said. Another said, "I was gonna say you are in the wrong place, until I saw Little Man (referring to my son)."

Bigmista
12-08-2006, 02:37 PM
I don't to the barber shop much anymore since my son lives with his mom about 75 miles away. I cut my own hair but I always took him there. Could always fall into a heated discussion there.

Come to think of it, it's kinda like here.

Harbormaster
12-08-2006, 02:48 PM
I think barbeque is like hockey, except with less Canadians.

I don't care who ya are, that there's funny.

Only been to a couple comps (of course, both were in the Midwest, one of them extremely 'rural') and I did not see a big mix of races at either.
The one thing I did notice that it didn't matter what color, creed, or other ethnic group one wants to lump themselves into, everyone was polite, nice, kind and caring.
Thats what matters to me.

Sawdustguy
12-08-2006, 04:33 PM
Not to hijack the thread but Plowboy you have a fine looking young man there. My wife thinks he is adorable.

Plowboy
12-08-2006, 04:37 PM
Not to hijack the thread but Plowboy you have a fine looking young man there. My wife thinks he is adorable.

Thanks. He turns a lot of heads.

Bigmista
12-08-2006, 04:42 PM
My last comment is...

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=4545&stc=1&d=1165602131
I'm trying to raise a black comp bbq'er myself!!! Well, not in Texas, but he'll be in the MoKan area. I have a dream of my sons either taking over the team one day or having a team of their own like Andy Groneman taking the que from his dad.

MMMMM...boiled kid!:mrgreen: :lol: :mrgreen: :lol: :rotf:

Kevin
12-08-2006, 05:21 PM
I guess I'm just a little bit different because I just like to have a good time and it doesn't matter who it's with. MrsMista thinks I'm crazy cause I wake up in the morning dancing by myself.

I celebrate everybody's holidays. I'm Irish on St. Patricks day. I'm Mexican on Cinco de Mayo. Hell if they had a party, I'd be Jewish on Yom Kippur. I've never been afraid to go out and experience someone else's culture and probably look pretty goofy doing it. Might be why I feel comfortable here.

If that makes other people feel comfortable and open more doors, then so be it.

Uhm, we could be brothers. I'm singing and dancing in the shower every morning. My bride thinks I'm crazy. I just love life. Every day, every minute. Enjoy it brothers. And respect all others while you're at it.

Rub N Smoke
12-08-2006, 06:00 PM
Ive never really thaught of it, but if it matters a Black man taught me some of the basics. When I do cooks I dont look at the color of the competitors 'cause I just want to make better Q than 'em all no matter what color!

big brother smoke
12-08-2006, 08:10 PM
Since our barber moved to a new shop, it isn't as lively. He's younger and cuts all of the kids and young men. Now, at the old shop, the old guys would sit in the back with the 60 something barber. Now those guys could talk about nothing all damn day. They didn't sensor themselves because I was there, either. I'm a shut your mouth and listen kinda guy anyway.

One morning we were their early and were the first ones in the front of the shop. The lights weren't even on. We can in the front door and startled them. They thought someone was coming in to rob them... so one guy said. Another said, "I was gonna say you are in the wrong place, until I saw Little Man (referring to my son)."

Yep, can't stand the young shops! No depth to the conversations!

big brother smoke
12-08-2006, 08:11 PM
Come to think of it, it's kinda like here.[/quote]

Precisely!

BrooklynQ
12-08-2006, 08:30 PM
I celebrate everybody's holidays. I'm Irish on St. Patricks day. I'm Mexican on Cinco de Mayo. Hell if they had a party, I'd be Jewish on Yom Kippur. I've never been afraid to go out and experience someone else's culture and probably look pretty goofy doing it. Might be why I feel comfortable here.


You've also been WhiteTrash (************************************/2006/02/smoking-car-4-bigmista-survival.html)! Let me re-phrase that. You ARE WhiteTrash. (************************************/2006/02/smoking-car-4-bigmista-survival.html) Once WhiteTrash (************************************/2006/02/smoking-car-4-bigmista-survival.html), always WhiteTrash (************************************/2006/02/smoking-car-4-bigmista-survival.html). And I'm damned proud you are.

Wildcat
12-08-2006, 08:54 PM
I didn't read all the posts but localy there are several all black teams around here and they do good in competition. In 2005 a black team won it all in the Paducah, Ky contest, this year they came in third. Several others have won in Southern Ill.

When I lived in Memphis, Tn I knew of 9 all black teams plus several others with a mixed team.

Bigmista
12-09-2006, 12:27 PM
From what I can tell, Memphis and KY are exceptions to the rule. I don't think whether ther are good black cooks out there is the question. The question is why don't they compete?

BrooklynQ
12-09-2006, 12:46 PM
As I've heard from a couple of cooks, competting don't pay the bills.

Plowboy
12-09-2006, 05:48 PM
Yep, can't stand the young shops! No depth to the conversations!

Went there today. All I heard about today was Jay-Z. But I did get a bootleg copy of the new Pirates of the Carribean DVD for $5. :biggrin:

G$
12-14-2006, 01:06 PM
* * * * * thread.

Too bad I don't have any answers either. Just a couple anecdotes that support Neil's question:

In my SUPER LIMITED competition experience, I recall no black team members, let alone black teams.

A good percentage of the FEW local Q joints are owned or staffed by blacks, despite them being a very small % of the general population here.

One of the (black) coaches on my kid's youth athletic teams brought his little offset to the end of year picnic, and we talked barbecue for a minute. Apparently he has a larger set up at home to do large quantities. I asked if he competed and he said yes, but we did not get a chance to pursue it, and frankly I do not really think he does compete in sanctioned type events. I will have to follow up with him when I see him next.

SmokeInDaEye
12-14-2006, 01:44 PM
Everyone at Hudson Valley got to meet our black team member, Chris, who unfortunatley, can not cook and just likes to walk around the comps drinking wine and wearing orange clogs. I think barbeque is like hockey, except with less Canadians.

We also had an teammate from India there and periodically have a team member who prefers to be called Peaches.:biggrin: We are an equal opportunity team and we just like people and having a good time.

I do agree with the theory that it's cultural. I have a lot of black coworkers who think I'm a little nuts when I talk about contests I did and what I'm going to do next year. "You pay money to sit out in the rain all night?!!!"

But the middle aged white guys here think I'm the coolest person on the planet. Go figure.

big brother smoke
12-14-2006, 02:28 PM
Went there today. All I heard about today was Jay-Z. But I did get a bootleg copy of the new Pirates of the Carribean DVD for $5. :biggrin:

Yes, you can great deals!

Plowboy
12-14-2006, 10:18 PM
Yes, you can great deals!

And homemade sandwiches in ziplock baggies & bean pies sold by some guy walking around with a cardboard full. The experience is... in a word, colorful. A modern day slice of Americana.

Bigmista
12-14-2006, 11:16 PM
My father used to get all of his liquor at the barber shop and still gets some movies there. A bit off topic though...