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Dex
07-23-2013, 01:44 PM
We have our first competition approaching and we are working on our timeline.

Typically how long do you hold your brisket in the Cambro before slicing? Also, what is the maximum time you would feel comfortable holding your brisket before slicing?

Thanks

mobow
07-23-2013, 01:52 PM
About 4 hours for us. I have held one for over 6 hours for a family get together. Came out hot enough to still need gloves to handle. Keith

Podge
07-23-2013, 02:02 PM
typically 5 hours for me.

Wampus
07-23-2013, 02:24 PM
NORMALLY, it's around 4 hours for us, but that varies according to when it gets done, of course.

Dex
07-23-2013, 02:30 PM
NORMALLY, it's around 4 hours for us, but that varies according to when it gets done, of course.

Thanks Wampus.... we saw you guys at New Pal. You looked busy so we didn't bother you

smokinit
07-23-2013, 02:40 PM
3 to 4 for me

Jacked UP BBQ
07-23-2013, 02:42 PM
So in your time line you are trying to make part of it putting brisket into cambro? I would try and avoid that as much as possible

Dex
07-23-2013, 02:56 PM
So in your time line you are trying to make part of it putting brisket into cambro? I would try and avoid that as much as possible

Its unavoidable for us

Jacked UP BBQ
07-23-2013, 02:58 PM
I am not 100% sure on this, but I think a wsm is cheaper then a cambro. I am 100% against cambros, but I know a lot of people who use them have success.

Dex
07-23-2013, 03:02 PM
I am not 100% sure on this, but I think a wsm is cheaper then a cambro. I am 100% against cambros, but I know a lot of people who use them have success.

I bought 2 for $50 on craigslist!

INmitch
07-23-2013, 03:11 PM
I am not 100% sure on this, but I think a wsm is cheaper then a cambro. I am 100% against cambros, but I know a lot of people who use them have success.
???????Really. I hold brisket in a small cooler. But I would hold it in a cambro if I had another one. How do you hold briskets?

Q-Dat
07-23-2013, 03:14 PM
I am not 100% sure on this, but I think a wsm is cheaper then a cambro. I am 100% against cambros, but I know a lot of people who use them have success.

Just curious. Why are you against them?

Jacked UP BBQ
07-23-2013, 03:25 PM
I dont hold brisket unless I am catering, cambros are for catering. I know people have to use them for cooker space, but taking a piece of meat directly off of a cooker and letting it rest for 30 minutes will most likely give you best results. Like I said many people cambro and cooler. There is just no benefit if its not necessary.

fnbish
07-23-2013, 04:00 PM
I dont hold brisket unless I am catering, cambros are for catering. I know people have to use them for cooker space, but taking a piece of meat directly off of a cooker and letting it rest for 30 minutes will most likely give you best results. Like I said many people cambro and cooler. There is just no benefit if its not necessary.

Seems like a lot tools/equipment BBQ teams have are things that were never intended to be used in the manner in which we use them :becky:.

porkingINpublic
07-23-2013, 04:05 PM
We are having trouble with briskets too.... They are probe tender, then we take them off and into the cambro for a couple of hours, when we go to slice the are hot but they seem to have tightened back up. They aren't very tender at all.

Smokin' D
07-23-2013, 04:08 PM
Got a 1st place in brisket. Held in a Cambro, basically a vertical cooler, for about 6 hours. Pretty damn tender and juicy! I like having the big meats done at least four hours before turn ins. Makes for a much more relaxed event.

Jacked UP BBQ
07-23-2013, 04:22 PM
If they allowed warming cabinets electric, would you use those?

Untraceable
07-23-2013, 04:22 PM
Im a comp n00b but I dont understand how you time something that is done when its done. I understand timing ribs/chicken but brisket and butts?

Dex
07-23-2013, 04:32 PM
Im a comp n00b but I dont understand how you time something that is done when its done. I understand timing ribs/chicken but brisket and butts?

Well depending on your cooker setup, you may not be able to put your ribs or chicken in the same cooker with your big meats.... which means your big meats would have to be done and out of the cooker before they go in. Which means you need to know how long your big meats are going to take to cook so your ribs and chicken are done on time.

Im a noob too... so I may be off a bit :becky:

rookiedad
07-23-2013, 08:32 PM
If they allowed warming cabinets electric, would you use those?

would you ever use a low temp wsm as a holding cabinet. if so what temp would you need to keep it at to keep briskets from overcooking once done?

bigdogphin
07-23-2013, 08:59 PM
would you ever use a low temp wsm as a holding cabinet. if so what temp would you need to keep it at to keep briskets from overcooking once done?

I think he means just add another cooker for your chix or ribs rather than buying or using a cambros.... If someone was worried about space to get all their meats cooked.....

djqualls
07-23-2013, 10:00 PM
I like to cambro for around 4 hours before turn in time. THE KEY TO THIS..... after you pull it let it vent and stall the cooking process. i.e. if you pull at 205 pull it and let it drop to 195 then close the wrap and put back in the cambro. Just remember in KCBS, Bark is over rated so if it gets soft, consider it a gift when slicing in my opinion.

Good Luck.

Cayman1
07-24-2013, 09:38 AM
It would be nice to know if there is an optimum holding time for briskets and butts. I like to get them done and resting just so things aren't quite so hectic at turn in.

Kave Dweller
07-24-2013, 10:22 AM
Got two calls in last three comps on brisket, one rested for 5 hours, one rested for maybe 30 minutes (it was not cooperating). I am for 4 hours so I can use that smoker for chicken (time to get temp up), doesn't always work out as planned, but puzzled us that rest didn't seem to make a huge difference.

fnbish
07-24-2013, 10:27 AM
What are folks theories on Venting vs Not Venting before it goes into the cambro? Are you basing it on time like if it come off 4hrs before turn in you vent "x" amount of time and if it cooks longer and comes 2hrs before turn in you vent less? Or do you vent to a specific temp?

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 10:58 AM
There is no benefit to using a cambro in a BBQ comp, thats why I wonder why so many teams use them. I talk to teams that actually use it as part of their process thinking that it actually makes the meat better. Its not possible. When I go to a comp I always make a joke that every team must have a catering job and they are going to fill their cambro and send it on the road for delivery. If my pork is done at 7am or 11am it never touches a cambro, same as brisket. A pork butt will not cool down in the summer wrapped up in foil that was brought up to 205 or whatever temp you cook until. Not only that there are ways to get it hotter that would benefit your product rather than holding hot. Once again this is just my opinion, If you have to make a choice buy a cambro or a wsm or a cooker comparable in price, buy the cooker and start your big meats much later. You will be happier. Think of it like this, would you cook a steak and throw it in a cambro for a few hours? A cambro is holding not resting, resting involves temps going down not maintaining.

gettinbasted
07-24-2013, 11:09 AM
There is no benefit to using a cambro in a BBQ comp, thats why I wonder why so many teams use them. I talk to teams that actually use it as part of their process thinking that it actually makes the meat better. Its not possible. When I go to a comp I always make a joke that every team must have a catering job and they are going to fill their cambro and send it on the road for delivery. If my pork is done at 7am or 11am it never touches a cambro, same as brisket. A pork butt will not cool down in the summer wrapped up in foil that was brought up to 205 or whatever temp you cook until. Not only that there are ways to get it hotter that would benefit your product rather than holding hot. Once again this is just my opinion, If you have to make a choice buy a cambro or a wsm or a cooker comparable in price, buy the cooker and start your big meats much later. You will be happier. Think of it like this, would you cook a steak and throw it in a cambro for a few hours? A cambro is holding not resting, resting involves temps going down not maintaining.

To each their own, but comparing a brisket to a steak doesn't make a lot of sense. The goal in cooking a brisket is to break down collagen and connective tissue. This breakdown process can be accomplished in its entirety on the smoker, or be finished in a cambro. The longer you can hold meat in this breakdown zone without over cooking it, the more moist your brisket will be. I agree that a cambro is not resting, but it can be more than just holding.

A steak is already a relatively tender product, but some chefs will sous vide a steak for the exact same reasons.

Know Bull
07-24-2013, 11:09 AM
I like to cambro for around 4 hours before turn in time. THE KEY TO THIS..... after you pull it let it vent and stall the cooking process. i.e. if you pull at 205 pull it and let it drop to 195 then close the wrap and put back in the cambro. Just remember in KCBS, Bark is over rated so if it gets soft, consider it a gift when slicing in my opinion.

Good Luck.

I agree with David regarding the bark. I believe that the only people that are obsessed with bark are the people that are cooking. The people that are eating do not focus on bark, and will often believe that the meat is overcooked if there is too much crunchy bark. All you really need is just enough 'bark' that your seasoning is stuck to the meat. Now think about how many people were cooking and how many were eating at your last event - I think I will choose to appease the masses.

My opinion on holding time is to not set a goal on a specific amount of time to hold. I believe that you need a BARE MINIMUM of 30 minutes, just to let the meat achieve equilibrium and re-absorb (or redistribute) some of the juices. Any holding time beyond that is just a function of your specific situation on that cook. Big meats may have different cooking times even when the cuts are the same size. And there can be big variances, especially at contests where you have to deal with weather, power failures, falling asleep on your fire management, etc, etc. So your goal (at home or in a contest) is to: (a) have the meat ready to go at the appropriate time; and/or (b) free up space in your cooker for small meats. Longer holding periods do not necessarily have a negative impact on big meats - PROVIDED that you follow David's advice and stop the cooking process before putting the meat in your holding container. But an excessive hold period will hurt you on small meats. So you build your timing variances into the big meats, and micro-manage the small meats to be ready at the last possible moment. Just a juggling act - keeping all the balls in the air.

Q-Dat
07-24-2013, 11:46 AM
What are folks theories on Venting vs Not Venting before it goes into the cambro? Are you basing it on time like if it come off 4hrs before turn in you vent "x" amount of time and if it cooks longer and comes 2hrs before turn in you vent less? Or do you vent to a specific temp?

I think it depends on how you determine doneness. If you cook more by internal temp, then I don't think its a good idea to vent. At 200* a brisket's connective tissue may or may not have broken down completely and probably will benefit from going straight into the cambro and continuing to cook very slowly for the next few hours. If you cool it before it goes into holding, the tissues may tighten back up again giving you an end product that's not as tender as it was when it came off the cooker.

If you cook by feel, and pull your brisket when it probes like "buttah" then the connective tissue has most likely broken down all the way. In this case if you don't let that internal temp come down to about 175 or so, then that probe tender brisket which is probably over 200* is going to take a LONG time to get down to holding temp, and as a result the neat fibers will begin to break down resulting in overcooked brisket that will be difficult if not impossible to slice

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 11:47 AM
To each their own, but comparing a brisket to a steak doesn't make a lot of sense. The goal in cooking a brisket is to break down collagen and connective tissue. This breakdown process can be accomplished in its entirety on the smoker, or be finished in a cambro. The longer you can hold meat in this breakdown zone without over cooking it, the more moist your brisket will be. I agree that a cambro is not resting, but it can be more than just holding.

A steak is already a relatively tender product, but some chefs will sous vide a steak for the exact same reasons.

Sous Vide and holding in a cambro is totally two different ends of the spectrum. So you are telling me you pull your brisket off and put it into a cambro to continue breaking down collagen and connective tissue? Thats whats cooking it is for. If you are going to to tell me you are going to continue cooking in an uncontrolled atmosphere like a cambro to give you better results that is silly. I am a professionally trained chef with an education also in culinary arts and you can argue with me until you are blue in the face, there is no benefit of a cambro for any meat, anytime.

gettinbasted
07-24-2013, 12:17 PM
Sous Vide and holding in a cambro is totally two different ends of the spectrum. So you are telling me you pull your brisket off and put it into a cambro to continue breaking down collagen and connective tissue? Thats whats cooking it is for. If you are going to to tell me you are going to continue cooking in an uncontrolled atmosphere like a cambro to give you better results that is silly. I am a professionally trained chef with an education also in culinary arts and you can argue with me until you are blue in the face, there is no benefit of a cambro for any meat, anytime.

Congrats on your pedigree, that is very impressive. And yes, that is what I am telling you. I cambro my big meats for a period of time because they are cooked to a temperature where the muscle fibers will start to squeeze out the juice if they go to a higher temperature, but more collagen and connective tissue will still break down.

Your way is very valid so keep on doing it. I just disagree that "there is no benefit of a cambro for any meat, anytime". There is certainly no benefit to a closed mind and a blanket statement against other cooker's techniques.

gettinbasted
07-24-2013, 12:18 PM
Sous Vide and holding in a cambro is totally two different ends of the spectrum.

So are cooking a brisket and cooking a steak.

INmitch
07-24-2013, 12:31 PM
Sous Vide and holding in a cambro is totally two different ends of the spectrum. So you are telling me you pull your brisket off and put it into a cambro to continue breaking down collagen and connective tissue? Thats whats cooking it is for. If you are going to to tell me you are going to continue cooking in an uncontrolled atmosphere like a cambro to give you better results that is silly. I am a professionally trained chef with an education also in culinary arts and you can argue with me until you are blue in the face, there is no benefit of a cambro for any meat, anytime.

So I take it that your putting your meat back on the heat before turnins. I'm just not getting your point. If your big meats are done 2-4 hours before turnins, your just leaving them set out wrapped on a table? That or there is more to your process than your letting us know. Which is confusing me and I'm sure some others not as seasoned as me.
It's got me thinking I should go throw away all my 1st place brisket trophies n 180 pins because I've been doing it wrong.

INmitch
07-24-2013, 12:38 PM
I guess my point is apparently your doing far different than the norm. Which is fine. But there are quite a few people on here new to comps, and I think your steering them in the wrong direction.

Off my soapbox now.:icon_blush:

roksmith
07-24-2013, 12:43 PM
For me, the biggest advantage to using a cambro for competitions is mostly about timing. Not completely, but mostly. Having a process that allows for every one of my meats to live in a cambro for some period of time allows me to have zero timing issues. I also happpen to believe that all of the meats.. not just the large meats benefit from some time in the warm box.

Q-Dat
07-24-2013, 01:25 PM
Think the great thing about the Cambro is that there is no heat source inside it. They hold heat so well that you don't need one. You can accurately predict how long a cooked mass of meat is going to hold its temp.

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 01:54 PM
You can cook your brisket how ever you would like. Hot holding is fine if it works for you. My "pedigree" has nothing to do with this other than you talking like you have the entire science of a cambro figured out when in fact saying it makes a piece of meat more moist is completely an opinion not a fact. As far as all of your first place finishes and 180 pins congrats to you, if you feel a cambro is a necessity to cook a brisket thats your opinion. Mine is that it is completely not needed and there is no reason to teach or "steer" all the new people on here to believe a cambo is a need for a bbq comp because it is not. Keep camboing if it works for you, I will continue to not cambro because it works for me on pork and brisket. My original point was to purchase more cooking room, there are good cookers that are cheaper than a good cambro.

Dex
07-24-2013, 01:58 PM
This thread became interesting. Never thought it would turn into this :pop2:

Cayman1
07-24-2013, 02:15 PM
Got two calls in last three comps on brisket, one rested for 5 hours, one rested for maybe 30 minutes (it was not cooperating).

We have had exactly the same thing happen with the same result, calls for both. That's why I wonder if there is any benefit to resting more than 30 minutes other than timing.

We use a cooler, not a cambro and do so just to keep the meat above the danger zone prior to turn in. Don't really try to cook it more although I think that happens occasionally when we don't vent and cool quite enough before the cooler. Come to think of it, the last time that happened, I thought the brisket was overcooked but we got a call anyway, but heck, what do I know about it. I feel good if I don't drop it on the floor of the trailer. By that time of the day, I'm pretty wiped.

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 02:15 PM
Dex - to answer your question in my opinion, you can keep a brisket hot in a pan wrapped tight in foil for hours, you will also have the availability to reheat more towards turn in time if you need to. You can throw them in a cambro if it makes you feel comfortable about keeping it hot and breaking down more collagen. But coming from me and "my opinion" you dont need to.

Sledneck
07-24-2013, 02:17 PM
I Love My Cambro!

INmitch
07-24-2013, 02:19 PM
Jacked Up I now see the point you were trying to make. For the record...I hold my briskets in the same $14 28 qt Coleman cooler I've been using for 5 years now (ya I'm superstitious).:biggrin1:
















Butts go in the cambro.:heh:

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
07-24-2013, 02:21 PM
So I take it that your putting your meat back on the heat before turnins. I'm just not getting your point. If your big meats are done 2-4 hours before turnins, your just leaving them set out wrapped on a table? That or there is more to your process than your letting us know. Which is confusing me and I'm sure some others not as seasoned as me.
It's got me thinking I should go throw away all my 1st place brisket trophies n 180 pins because I've been doing it wrong.

just a side note, I cook sooo hot that yes, my brisket can and does sit on a table wrapped in a heavy bath towel ( no not the one I use in the tub, an old one :twitch:) for 2-3 hours easily and will burn my hands when I pull it from the towel and foil.

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
07-24-2013, 02:23 PM
I Love My Cambro!

and let me guess your vacuum marinade tumbler as well.

BB-Kuhn
07-24-2013, 02:23 PM
Im a comp n00b but I dont understand how you time something that is done when its done. I understand timing ribs/chicken but brisket and butts?

Practice.

Cayman1
07-24-2013, 02:33 PM
Im a comp n00b but I dont understand how you time something that is done when its done. I understand timing ribs/chicken but brisket and butts?

You are exactly correct, it is done when it is done, not time, not temp. Do enough though and you will have an idea of about how long the average brisket takes depending on its weight. Like I said above, that sometimes doesn't happen. The brisket we had finish 30 min. before turn in finished a good 3 hours after the other one we cooked that day. Both 15 lbs and both Creekstone Farms Prime Angus briskets. Go figure.

Oh, the brisket that finished 30 minutes before turn in was the one we used and got us a call.

Cue's Your Daddy
07-24-2013, 02:48 PM
i love my cambro!

he'sss baaaaackkkkk.

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 03:06 PM
He destroyed our brisket this past weekend in a ****ing cambro

EJHOFFY
07-24-2013, 03:15 PM
Hey Jacked Up, I have to ask. Are you cooking your briskets to finish as close as possible to turn in or are you re-warming meat back up to a certain temp ? I don't compete much but have been trying both ways.

Cue's Your Daddy
07-24-2013, 03:20 PM
Hey Jacked Up, I have to ask. Are you cooking your briskets to finish as close as possible to turn in or are you re-warming meat back up to a certain temp ? I don't compete much but have been trying both ways.

When SLed and Matt cook, its a toss up when things are going to be finished. :thumb:

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 03:41 PM
In a perfect world, brisket finishes right around chicken turn in

Sledneck
07-24-2013, 04:02 PM
He destroyed our brisket this past weekend in a ****ing cambro

Yes I Did! Lesson learned. Although According To What I Read Above You ShoulD Of Cambro That 27Th Place Chicken! Hahaha

Sledneck
07-24-2013, 04:04 PM
and let me guess your vacuum marinade tumbler as well.

Is Nothing Sacred? You Gonna Now Tell.Everybody I Use Grillz Blazin Sauce?

boogiesnap
07-24-2013, 05:25 PM
matt, can i have your cambros? :becky:

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 10:56 PM
matt, can i have your cambros? :becky:

i have a bunch unfortunately i use them all for catering

Jacked UP BBQ
07-24-2013, 10:58 PM
Yes I Did! Lesson learned. Although According To What I Read Above You ShoulD Of Cambro That 27Th Place Chicken! Hahaha

my chicken was perfect until you made those skinny skins if yours, i hope you enjoyed your scraping because it will never happen again!:clap:

Smokin' Gnome BBQ
07-25-2013, 07:36 AM
Is Nothing Sacred? You Gonna Now Tell.Everybody I Use Grillz Blazin Sauce?

I thought you used A&W rootbeer sauce..

Southern Touch BBQ
07-25-2013, 10:48 AM
two benefits of a holding box for us

1. brisket and pork get done early in the morning and counter space is valuable in a cook trailer

2. i don't like the idea of taking 200* meat off of the cooker and putting it on a stainless steel table in a cold air conditioned cook trailer for the next 5 hours

Vince RnQ
07-25-2013, 02:44 PM
2. i don't like the idea of taking 200* meat off of the cooker and putting it on a stainless steel table in a cold air conditioned cook trailer for the next 5 hours


I think you should abandon your air conditioned cook trailer and cook under canopies. That will eliminate your need for a cambro.


<tongue in cheek mod>

boogiesnap
07-25-2013, 05:38 PM
Is Nothing Sacred? You Gonna Now Tell.Everybody I Use Grillz Blazin Sauce?

not to hijack, but i can't find that sauce anywhere? where do i get it???

boogiesnap
07-25-2013, 07:39 PM
my chicken was perfect until you made those skinny skins if yours, i hope you enjoyed your scraping because it will never happen again!:clap:

BTW, i can scrape skin, 7 bones a thigh. see R2BQ stamford, ct. results. :becky:

have knife, will travel.

chipb22
07-25-2013, 07:56 PM
Two questions on this.
Will a cooler work if you don't have a Cambro
And doesn't the meat continue to cook if its retaining its heat.

boogiesnap
07-25-2013, 08:00 PM
yes, and yes.

Sledneck
07-25-2013, 08:04 PM
my chicken was perfect until you made those skinny skins if yours, i hope you enjoyed your scraping because it will never happen again!:clap:
don't blame your cooking incompetence on the scraped skins. next time try my rib sauce on them thighs

Sledneck
07-25-2013, 08:05 PM
not to hijack, but i can't find that sauce anywhere? where do i get it???

at restaurant depot. soon you will be able to purchase it from jacked up ,newest sponsor. they have been so happy with our results using it

boogiesnap
07-25-2013, 09:07 PM
no sh*t!!! nice get matt!!

i've always used cattlemans from RD. i'll have to look for GB. :clap2:

thanks sled.

boogiesnap
07-25-2013, 09:16 PM
hey, maybe you guys can take this into PM or another thread regarding teammates having differnces of opinions???

to the OP, the best briskets i've had that i've cooked myself were rested for an hour or two wrapped sitting out.

unfortunately i do not have the skill or talent to replicate this timing at a comp. so i cooler/cambro.

Muzzlebrake
07-25-2013, 10:31 PM
He destroyed our brisket this past weekend in a ****ing cambro

Dude don't blame that on the Cambro. It was farked when it came off the heat...:becky:


Dex,

I agree with Matt in that I try to finish my meats to have as little hold time as possible before turn ins. I also agree with his point it's more cost effective and you are better off to buy a another low cost cooker instead of a Cambro if space is an issue.

That being said I find a Cambro to a very beneficial tool especially when it comes to the unpredictability of the big meats. I try to time mine very close but more often than not I wind up holding them for at least an hour. Unlike Matt, I like to minimize the number of variables and would rather hold my meats in the more controlled environment of the cambro than on an open countertop.

As far a specific amount of time you can hold a brisket, I think that is going to vary depending on equipment, outside temp., etc. but I think it's safe to say a large number of people are regularly holding 4-6 hours with good results.

Now you just need to figure out how long works for you. :rockon:

Wampus
07-25-2013, 11:27 PM
We used a Cambro a little last year, but don't anymore. Perhaps we just weren't venting the big meats enough, but we were getting overcooked results.

We use pizza bags wrapped in fleece blankets now. One for brisket, one for pork. LOTS cheaper than a cambro, breathes a little better. We still vent the big meats first before holding them though.



Thanks Wampus.... we saw you guys at New Pal. You looked busy so we didn't bother you

Aww, dude.....you should have gave a shout out. We were definitely likely busy since we were vending and competing there and it was at two different sites. Not a lot of down time last weekend. Still.....wish you would've stopped by. Would have liked to meet you.

Dex
07-26-2013, 09:36 AM
Never thought of that one. Will have to keep it in mind

We used a Cambro a little last year, but don't anymore. Perhaps we just weren't venting the big meats enough, but we were getting overcooked results.

We use pizza bags wrapped in fleece blankets now. One for brisket, one for pork. LOTS cheaper than a cambro, breathes a little better. We still vent the big meats first before holding them though.





Aww, dude.....you should have gave a shout out. We were definitely likely busy since we were vending and competing there and it was at two different sites. Not a lot of down time last weekend. Still.....wish you would've stopped by. Would have liked to meet you.