PDA

View Full Version : Can it be THAT different???


Qbert60
05-19-2013, 07:38 AM
I had the pleasure of hosting 2 CBJ's this weekend as they were working towards their master cert. Anyway, they obviously gave me their feedback. I was hoping it was honest and they were not just appeasing me. Anyway, they said my pork was good, ribs were awesome, brisket was tender and chicken was bland. They wrote down theirs scores and we talked about it at length.

This is what the judges scored me. Finished 25th out of 35

Chicken - 888 978 787 889 899 878
Ribs - 978 977 988 987 988 989
Pork - 888 857 987 877 766 877 (I thought I killed someone. 34 out of 35)
Brisket - 977 999 888 887 877 786

Should I think about re-working flavor profiles or anything else? Do you think that. Here are pics of my turn-ins. Please let me know what you think

sweetracks
05-19-2013, 07:43 AM
Hey Bert, I think your boxes look pretty good. I'm interested in your chicken, and want a taste! Something I've learned about pork, at least in MI and IN, they like sauce. We upped our sauce on pork last year and it payed off. Just my .02. Will you be in Westmont? If so stop by so we can talk some more. We'll be there Friday by noon.

Qbert60
05-19-2013, 07:56 AM
Hey Bert, I think your boxes look pretty good. I'm interested in your chicken, and want a taste! Something I've learned about pork, at least in MI and IN, they like sauce. We upped our sauce on pork last year and it payed off. Just my .02. Will you be in Westmont? If so stop by so we can talk some more. We'll be there Friday by noon.

Thanks Josh. No Westmont is a little too far for me. I was thinking about it, but deciding against the 8 hour trip. This is the best my chicken has EVER looked. I was super happy with it. I was told by an Ohio native that BH sauce isn't liked. Heck, should have used SBR instead.

fweck
05-19-2013, 08:13 AM
Hijack? I would have given 9s for appearance for everything but the brisket; and probably an 8 or 9 for that. Here's the hijack, on the right side, instead of a 90 degree cut, would a slightly angled, or rounded look be better?

fweck
05-19-2013, 08:14 AM
Oh, and the chicken looks awesome :-D

FormulatedFire
05-19-2013, 09:21 AM
How do these results compare to your previous competitions?

I wouldn't suggest changing anything drastic unless your results have been this way for 2-3 competitions in a row. There is going to be some variation from competition to competition unless you get the same judges for every competition which is unlikely.

Everything looks pretty good from here. Only thing that stands out significantly is that the front right hand chicken is much larger than the rest and appears to be touching the box. Not a huge deal, but some will mark you down for this.

Just my 2 cents

Podge
05-19-2013, 09:23 AM
in my honest opinion, 7 maybe an 8 at best for any of those boxes. Maybe bad lighting during the pics.

Lake Dogs
05-19-2013, 09:32 AM
^^^ +1

Dont change anything until you've had 2 or 3 or more contests, and then when you do change, test your new product side-by-side with your previous recipe. Only then will you know if you're making progress. Otherwise it's a crap-shoot.

If/when you begin making changes:

Chicken - 888 978 787 889 899 878
Ribs - 978 977 988 987 988 989
Pork - 888 857 987 877 766 877
Brisket - 977 999 888 887 877 786

I'll assume this is a KCBS system.

Chicken, presentation could be improved, tenderness not too bad, taste not too bad. Perhaps slight tweaks, but nothing major.

Ribs, you received two 7's on flavor when they gave you 9's in presentation/appearance. We tend to "eat with our eyes", so something in the taste was disappointing to these two folks... Again, not bad scores, but consider a slight tweak.

Pork, obviously work to be done here. You were fairly slammed on taste and tenderness. Was it tough, or perhaps the MM slices were really mushy? Taste; needs works.

Brisket, taste got 1 9, an 8, and then 7's and a 6. I'd focus here on your brisket.

Bentley
05-19-2013, 11:59 AM
I don't know how many times a year you compete? We have been competing 11 years and I think one year we did 5 competitions, many times it was 2 or 3 and they might be 3-4 months apart. Impossible to get any real data...I would say, cook the same for at least 3 contest in a row if that is possible?

You need some baseline to see was it just a table at this contest or is it truly a problem with the flavor!



Should I think about re-working flavor profiles or anything else? Do you think that. Here are pics of my turn-ins. Please let me know what you think

kenthanson
05-19-2013, 05:22 PM
Looks like you had some people just lookin to fill their coolers, how else would you explain the 6's and 7's!!!!

bigdogphin
05-19-2013, 05:49 PM
in my honest opinion, 7 maybe an 8 at best for any of those boxes. Maybe bad lighting during the pics.

This......

Chicken and ribs and brisket don't look appealing to me... On pork don't be afraid to fill up your box..

sfisch
05-19-2013, 07:55 PM
Skippy,
Like several others said, don't change flavor profiles after 1 comp, let it ride for at least 3 then subtle changes.

Qbert60
05-20-2013, 08:04 AM
How do these results compare to your previous competitions?

I wouldn't suggest changing anything drastic unless your results have been this way for 2-3 competitions in a row. There is going to be some variation from competition to competition unless you get the same judges for every competition which is unlikely.

Everything looks pretty good from here. Only thing that stands out significantly is that the front right hand chicken is much larger than the rest and appears to be touching the box. Not a huge deal, but some will mark you down for this.

Just my 2 cents

Thanks for your 2 cents. Much appreciated. I am a fairly new team. I know that I have a lot of learning still to do. I competed in Indiana 2 weeks prior. I used the same flavor profiles, and finished in the top 15. The overall scores here were actually lower. Just makes me think that my stuff might not be as good as I thought.

Smoke&HoneyBBQ
05-20-2013, 09:45 AM
Where were you guys at? Glanced for you but did not see you.

We were hanging out near the funnel cake vendor.

Our chicken score seemed odd to us too:

989
978
988
997
965
966

Qbert60
05-20-2013, 10:24 AM
Where were you guys at? Glanced for you but did not see you.

We were hanging out near the funnel cake vendor.

Our chicken score seemed odd to us too:

989
978
988
997
965
966

We got lucky and were placed right by the turn in's. We were in the double EZ-ups in between the trailers. Is Ohio just full of inexperienced judges?

CBQ
05-20-2013, 05:32 PM
I was told by an Ohio native that BH sauce isn't liked. Heck, should have used SBR instead.

Yeah, we hear that from judges all the time. "We are so tired of Blues Hog" The thing is, it still wins. That's why people still use it. I wouldn't change it. Judges might claim to be tired of it, but until something else starts winning as consistently, people will put it in the box.

accuseal
05-21-2013, 05:26 PM
I feel better now. We finished 26th. How do you get all 8s and 9s and a 6??? I am a CBJ as well. This was very inconsistent judging. We'll give it another try before changing too much. I've seen the big boys finish well down in the list so I'm hanging in.

Qbert60
05-21-2013, 09:37 PM
I feel better now. We finished 26th. How do you get all 8s and 9s and a 6??? I am a CBJ as well. This was very inconsistent judging. We'll give it another try before changing too much. I've seen the big boys finish well down in the list so I'm hanging in.

I was privy'd to a pic of another competitors brisket. He finished lower than me. His brisket looked PHENOMENAL. Makes me not want to come back to OHIO. I hope Kettering is better.

landarc
05-21-2013, 09:59 PM
Looks like you had some people just lookin to fill their coolers, how else would you explain the 6's and 7's!!!!
I had a set of turn ins, and the chicken and pork both got marked down. Two comments, maybe from same judge, maybe not, I didn't see cards. Said they tasted like fish/aroma of fish. Nobody else said a thing, meats scored better than I would have expected.

Smoke&HoneyBBQ
05-22-2013, 02:18 PM
I feel better now. We finished 26th. How do you get all 8s and 9s and a 6??? I am a CBJ as well. This was very inconsistent judging. We'll give it another try before changing too much. I've seen the big boys finish well down in the list so I'm hanging in.

This was our first competition and looking at our scores I am not changing a single thing as far as rubs/sauces.

Brisket placed horrible but I know exactly where I screwed up and that was purely on me.

Ribs we got 13th on and used the same rub/sauce on pulled pork and got 30th.

Dan2446
05-22-2013, 07:58 PM
Qbert60,

After tasting all your submissions and seeing the scores that were turned in, I have to admit that I am a little embarrassed to be considered with those that judged some of your Q so low.

I can assure you that we both gave you our honest opinion and we both felt that some of the judges were absolutely nuts. There is no way that some of the scores should have been so low. You cooked quality products and unfortunately your food was not judged properly by (what I can only guess) was very inexperienced judges.

I would not change a thing and see how the next few contests go with the same flavor profiles.
Dan

Qbert60
05-23-2013, 09:32 AM
Qbert60,

After tasting all your submissions and seeing the scores that were turned in, I have to admit that I am a little embarrassed to be considered with those that judged some of your Q so low.

I can assure you that we both gave you our honest opinion and we both felt that some of the judges were absolutely nuts. There is no way that some of the scores should have been so low. You cooked quality products and unfortunately your food was not judged properly by (what I can only guess) was very inexperienced judges.

I would not change a thing and see how the next few contests go with the same flavor profiles.
Dan

Thanks Dan!

It was my pleasure hosting you guys. I will admit that I was pretty embarrassed at where I finished, but it is what it is. Thank you for all the help. Look forward to seeing you soon!

Qbert60
05-23-2013, 09:51 AM
^^^ +1

Dont change anything until you've had 2 or 3 or more contests, and then when you do change, test your new product side-by-side with your previous recipe. Only then will you know if you're making progress. Otherwise it's a crap-shoot.

If/when you begin making changes:

Chicken - 888 978 787 889 899 878
Ribs - 978 977 988 987 988 989
Pork - 888 857 987 877 766 877
Brisket - 977 999 888 887 877 786

I'll assume this is a KCBS system.

Chicken, presentation could be improved, tenderness not too bad, taste not too bad. Perhaps slight tweaks, but nothing major.

Ribs, you received two 7's on flavor when they gave you 9's in presentation/appearance. We tend to "eat with our eyes", so something in the taste was disappointing to these two folks... Again, not bad scores, but consider a slight tweak.

Pork, obviously work to be done here. You were fairly slammed on taste and tenderness. Was it tough, or perhaps the MM slices were really mushy? Taste; needs works.

Brisket, taste got 1 9, an 8, and then 7's and a 6. I'd focus here on your brisket.

Here is exactly how I turned in my Pork. I cooked one butt just for the money muscle. I pulled it at 195 internal and rested for 5 hours. The other one I cooked through all the way. I slice that one to see if the MM was OK to use, but is was too tender. I sliced the one I pulled off and it was MONEY. not mushy at all. I sliced and sauced it. The rest of the butt was a little dry, so I took the other MM and chopped it up, sauced it and put it in the box. Tasted good. Was that a mistake?